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Dossiers on India have no ‘material evidence’
ISLAMABAD: The Senate Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs was told on Thursday that dossiers given to the United States and United Nations Secretary General on India’s alleged involvement in terrorism in Pakistan did not contain ‘material evidence’.
Testifying before the Senate Foreign Affairs Committee, which met with Senator Nuzhat Sadiq in the chair, Adviser on Foreign Affairs Sartaj Aziz said the dossiers instead contained the “pattern and narrative” of Indian involvement.
“The dossiers have been meticulously prepared, but material evidence cannot be shared for the sake of protecting the sources,” he said, adding that the proofs could have only been provided to others in the narrative shape.
Also read: Dossiers of Indian hand in terrorism handed over to UN chief: Aziz
Mr Aziz had first talked about the three dossiers ahead of Pak-India National Security Advisers meeting, which was later cancelled. His statement led to a media hype that the government after decades of complaining about Indian role in terrorism in the country was finally readying to present credible evidence to the world.
Sartaj tells Senate committee dossiers given to US, UN contain ‘pattern and narrative’
Following the cancellation of the bilateral NSA talks, the dossiers were given to UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon by Pakistan’s Permanent Representative in the UN, Dr Maleeha Lodhi. The same were also shared by Mr Aziz with US Secretary of State John Kerry during Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif’s visit to Washington last month.
The dossiers, according to previous official statements, contained proofs about Indian involvement in Balochistan, Federally Administered Tribal Areas (Fata) and Karachi
While talking to media after the US visit, Mr Aziz had said that the dossiers would help build a narrative about India’s patronage of subversive activities in Pakistan.
Foreign Secretary Aizaz Ahmed Chaudhry told the committee that the contents of the dossiers could be shared with the members of the panel in an ‘in-camera’ session due to `the sensitivity of the matter’.
CPEC: Mr Chaudhry struggled to explain the omission of China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) from the joint statement issued after the meeting of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif with President Obama in Washington on Oct 22.
Senator Mushahid Hussain Sayed had pointed out that while the joint statement welcomed regional connectivity projects and named Afghanistan-Pakistan Transit Trade Agreement, the Central Asia South Asia Electricity Transmission and Trade Project (CASA-1000) electricity corridor, the Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India (TAPI) natural gas pipeline project, it curiously remained silent on CPEC.
Mr Chaudhry clarified that it was President Obama, who praised those projects and the same was noted in the joint statement.
He further said that the Pakistani side had briefed the Obama administration about CPEC and apparently they had no objection to it.
BANNED GROUPS: The foreign secretary disclosed that Falah-i-Insaniyat Foundation (FIF), a charity linked to Jamaat-ud-Dawah (JuD), was not among the organisations placed under observation.
FIF as per some of the earlier government statements was under watch.
It was not clear if the foreign secretary’s statement denoted a change in FIF’s status or he simply clarified the misperception that FIF was on the watch list.
UN listed FIF as a terrorist organisation in 2012 under UNSC Resolution 1267 and 1989.
JuD was meanwhile among the organisations whose activities were being supervised, Mr Chaudhry said.
Another related group, Lashkar-e-Taiba, he said, was a banned entity.
Published in Dawn, November 20th, 2015
Comments (90) Closed
Wow...what a shock!
Fantasies do not contain material sir. It's all about narrative.. Stop misguiding your people..
Self Goal, That much hype on the dossiers and it seems nothing credible there !
'We have evidence but we cannot show it'. What a great logic !
Good work, expose them on all fronts.
What good is the dossier if the material evidence against was not shared!!
"Pattern and Narrative". Layman term is conspiracy theory.
The truth is out!
I see the brilliance behind this strategy.
Total Rubbish.
Just hoodwinking the people.
Well played, lol
You can fool some of the people all the time!
@Farhan could you please enlighten the rest of us who missed seeing what you saw in it?
So the euphoria created by foreign office is only to fool the people.
pattern and narrative == imaginary stories for time pass
never tell again you have proofs. how it will help if you not able to show?
A good joke..
paranoid
Can somebody tell me what's happening ?
It is primary report with credible evidences. Material evidence can be provided at secondary stage. I believe providing "material evidence "at primary stage are very important.
So it was all about local consumption.
On the one hand complain about India on the other, push for playing cricket with them. How does this work?
@Divine Pakistan has to protect its sources at any cost, no value exposing them for small gains when they can get critical info when needed and can save the nation during war.
@Divine No one knows..lol
How can anybody believe the accusations?
This is what happens when a nation collectively lacks in education and professionalism.
This might be the reason, they don't want make it public or in media.
@Zak - do you really believe that cover story? If that were the case, then why go through the drama of the dossiers?
@Fact dossiers are intended to be present to the concerned country directly. In this case since talks were abandoned it did not happen. I am sure India would have made this public
@Zak trust you to put a positive spin to everything.
Please listen to sane people like Hussain Haqqani. Unless you face the truth how will you make a course correction. India has no designs on Pakistan. We have too many problems of our own.
Much a do about nothing. For sure there is nothing in the dossiers.
Well Mr.Sartaj Aziz you were needed to figure that a little earlier! And would've made sure it contained evidence.
India is your brother. indian don't want to give any troble to pakistan. But you need to trust. Just make good relation with india and try to become like india
Pakistan needs education on all fronts.
@UD. Why involve Pakistani people. People of most nations do not know what their leaders say or do. Infact " leaders" seldom know themselves.
@Aman you nailed it man, Diversionary tactics. But remember truth always prevails
Not only in Pakistan, a lot of Indian politicians' rhetoric is also meant for domestic consumption. We, the people of both countries need to use some common sense and understand. India is happy with the status quo and Pakistan wants to change it. There is no reason for India to do anything as long as the status quo is maintained. Stuff meant for domestic consumption, when escalated to an international platform by these politicians cause embarrassment to the entire nation
well, hope pakistanis will understand the politics.
@Divine yes "nothing"
This is the reason International community keeping silence on allegations and demands. This is to eye wash common people.
See why it's necessary for us to bring FO and Defense under Parliament? Establishment and agencies severely lack professionalism.
Misleading title: Mr.Aziz never said there is no material evidence, he said it is not shared to protect sources.
Well, we knew from beginning that this was all hot air. We in india have our own issue to tackle , let alone create any trouble for our brother Pakistan. Trust us and join us in developing our people together.
Accusations must be followed up by evidence.
It's just like we can't produce witness in court because of safety of witness and then loose the case. If this is valid argument of defeated lawyer then why we need witnesses.
@Asif Yes but not with hollow words...
Material evidence is a sacred secret... and must be protected at all costs. What a waste!
In a context that India has produced live terrorists as evidence in the past this is yet another nail in Pakistans credibility and reputation and almost laughable. Pakistans biggest enemy is the duplicity and incompetence of its own leaders. It is said that a nation gets the leaders it deserves. The good People of Pakistan deserve better they need s miracle in transformed leadership to stop the whole nation being cast as an international migrane!
How will there be credibility Mr. Aziz, the countless statements, narratives. People's social growth will be stunted by these kind of baseless & thoughtless statements.
Sartaj Sir, By misleading and hiding the truth, you hurt nobody, but your own people. That is what happens when power is not given to people of a nation, but is concentrated in the hands of a few military men. There is an old dictum, "To hide a lie once, you have to tell hundred more lies". Please be honest with your own citizens. That's why they put you there. Actually, they didn't put you there.
Good! so next trip to US/UN HQ assured - with another improved version!!
Accusation has nothing do do with evedence . It is used as per need. Dosiers are for hoisting in air during press conference. People should understand this to know foreign policy.
@komal s ...only if it is good for Pak
What about all that arms collected after the operation there was no Indian arms found.
@Chris ...Good one
@Zak I have proof that it's all conspiracy but I can not show you the proof to protect the innocents.
I can write narratives containing of hundred's of pages without substantial material / hard evidence they remain a fantasy. Stop playing the blame game and clean your house before accusing other.
One should not accuse anyone unless they can prove it. He should have waited till he had the proofs that can be shared otherwise people will stop believing you. Earning trust is hard but losing it is very easy.
Stronger pakisthan means more safe guard for india from Afghans & Iraqis. Why India want to destabilise Pakistan? I don't see any motive for accusations. Even if india invades Pakistan, can it rule it? Can USA rule Iraq/Syria/or any other land without approval from locals? All this drama for distracting people from real issues.
Why am I not surprised. What is the point of all this exercise. I don't think anyone will buy the argument that evidence has not been provided for protecting the sources. Shows that either there is no evidence and our officials blame India for almost anything and it serves as the story is easy to sell to the masses. India serves an easy scapegoat for them to shelve off their responsibility OR the government officials are extremely lazy and do not believe in application of mind. Shows why the country is in shambles.
@Huzaifa Akhtar: Totally Agreed Bro. we are fooled and US and UN does not believe us.
The reason behind cancelation of NSA level meeting is this that there was no material evidence to give to Indian counter part after so much euphoria created in the media. Pak government realise that India would spill their beans without any hesitation to defame Pakistan on world forum.
Much ado about nothing!!
On the other hand , India has material evidence of Pakistan's involvement in terrorist activities India. India has shown on TV , captured and killed Pakistani terrorists. Kargil is a concrete example , where regular Pakistani soldiers, killed and captured are shown on TV
@Zak you are living in the land of narratives not land of the pure..
There is difference between material and circumstantial evidence. If its truth why hide from Pakistani awaam ??
@Shakti -haha...agreed. this is a joke
Haha...this is so funny. God help them...
Amen!
@Rejoice I see. So you have lodged an FIR with the UN and US, expecting them to do further investigation in this regard. So, are you also going to foot the bills for that investigation? Just like you did for the investigation into Shaheed benazir Bhutto murder case? By the way, what was the outcome of the investigation?
did not contain ‘material evidence’?
Correct- continue to repeat enough number of times and hope it will be accepted as truth.
actually intelligent people have already left country for better future and existent rulers have no knowledge .they can please only local people but not international community. baseless alligations cannot be considered.
@Zak What do you want to convey?
We can expects this kind of issues in a political government!!!
@Zak :: Why can't you accept it as is, instead of giving it a spin?
@Rana When you know you can not share the evidence why shared the dossiers what is the use to who so ever you show this he will like to have the evidence, the people are not dull headed, yes you can spinn the story either show evidence or keep quit.
Truth always wins
the fact is that if pak had solid proof it would be plastered on the front page of every newspaper for weeks on end and youll know that very very well
May i know pak government if u dont have proof .. why u blamed us?? .. plz respect ur people .. dont play people feelings ...
Nature abhors vacuum. When one runs a country with no foreign minister but only with transient placeholders, when policy dictated by the Generals and not the cabinet, fluff is flaunted instead of substantive materials.
UN/USA already trashed reports and circled talk around Afghanistan. I checked WP and NYT of the visit, a bad news for Pakistan has face of democracy and through the soft coupe martial law is implemented. I was not surprise but it is not good.
The trouble with most of these third world countries is that the old guards even after attaining 70, 80 years of age, don't go home and retire comfortably. The concept of developing next-in-commands does not exist. Why don't they leave to provide space to the young ones to come up with fresh blood and new ideas current with the times? If they want to continue, they can engage in social services, or act as honorary consultants to provide the benefits of their past experiences. This I say impartially after reading the confused and repeated reports on this single subject. These old guards would never say spade is a spade.
Our leaders have contributed little or nothing. This is what leadership is all about in Pakistan, a pattern of narratives stretching for 68 long years. Other nations like China, South Korea, Singapore, Malaysia, India, etc have gone so much ahead of Pakistan, within the same time frame. Do leaders of other nations such as the above spend time doing totally futile, nonconstructive work, why cannot we expect better from our leaders, why cannot we concentrate on our problems and resolve them, why keep on making excuses and excuses, why cannot we progress and come out of this mindset. Just provide for law and order, and that will be a great service.
@Raj Patel wow . Mr. Raj india cancelled that meeting not pakista. Can you now explain why ??
Seriously!!. Now that's funny
@Burjor Rustomji you have hit the nail right on the head.
@Nangyal . Thank you for your support.