Mr An Qiguang who had served as a diplomat in Pakistan, announced that Chinese companies executing various CPEC projects would hire more Pakistani labour and mid-level managers. -- Does it mean they have not been hired so far, despite billions "spent" on infrastructure?

Debt repayments and profit repatriation from CPEC projects will begin in 2019, totaling about $1.5-$1.9 billion, and rising to $3-$3.5 billion by the following year. - Reuters.

If you are so certain that CEPC will not cause economic woes, then why all the secrecy? Why not make all details public and let everyone come to the same conclusion?

Shouting on top of your voices only reinforces that CPEC is reason for economy being in doldrums

According to available figures $20 billion has been invested in CPEC and 70,000 jobs have been created. Not very good ratios.

If China is a true friend of Pakistan, it should waive off debts given to Pakistan.

Things get fixed when you complaint about it. Good going IK.

Let the Indian commentators on this forum explain how bad CPEC is for Pakistan because they know better what's best for us and they want what's best for Pakistan .

China has done for Pakistan what no ally or Pakistani would do. Too many people without any idea of infrastructure financing and its long term macro benefits keep commenting negatively. I, for one, have worked in such project financing. It was a miracle for Pakistan and it is ungrateful and shameful to raise doubts afterwards. Love you China and Chinese leadership.

This is just the beginning ,worst days ahead

China who has amassed Trillions of dollars and we have 12 billion deficit with China that needs to be sorted out. We Pakistanis love China through the test of times we have shown that to our Sino brothers and China should also help in converting many of the loans into grants, this way Pakistan can progress faster and it will be helpful for China also. All the Anti CPEC propaganda will be shut down fast.

CPEC projects, especially power projects have direct and indirect link to present economic crises.Chinese power projects are outdated based on imported thermal fuels that produce expensive power that industry cannot afford and consumer is suffering from overpricing. It makes hard for Pakistani industry to compete internationally, leading to fall in exports. Second part of infrastructure, Ports, roads and bridges are for Chinese use for their exports, so why are we paying for them. The biggest problem with CPEC is lack of revenue stream to pay for the loans and expenses. How can anyone plan projects worth Billions without knowing exactly how the income is generated? CPEC needs to be halted until proper planning and review is done of each and every project. CPEC must have economic justification in terms of future income to pay for the investment/loans, otherwise Pakistan will get deeper into crises, nation's future is at stake. Geo Pakistan.

A wonderful explanation by China. Accordingly Pak must explain to IMF, and immediately take a revolutionary step to balance the trade deficit, to 0 =0 How very easy, award all exporters to equal amount of import license for any/all item importable in Pak as per import policy, these import permits must be transferable to other importers, Obviously a market rate of premium say 5% will emerge, that could be an added incentive to exporters. A crave for export will develop, besides deficit will not occur due to equal amount of licence. The only problem spared to remain will be petroleum imports, so curtail petroleum imports, more attention be given to domestic exploration, and less tariffs on electric cars, If more e- cars on road, means less pollution, and less petrol imports. The overseas Pak can also be extended such incentives, equal to their remittances through banks, they be awarded import licence of equal amount, they may sell the licence in market, deficit will be at par.

CPEC is pro Pak initiative. China is a genuine friend. We Pakistanis simply wish to stand on our two feet and earn China's friendship. No project needs to be cancelled...but some can be revised.

CPEC is not responsible for Pakistan’s economic woes, says China. No one said it was.

US narrative very strong here. China needs to enter our media to share its version of the story and end western media dominance. Chinese information outlets for instance are doing an excellent job but they are limited. Social media is a free tool.

That's right,a very small part of their loan is being paid at the moment. But in future it will be a major component. But they probably won't want loan to be paid back in monetary terms. They want to make sure that Pakistan remain in their orbit forever and Gwadar will be kept by them for 100 years using it as military and trade outpost after which the infrastructure would be all worn-out and outdated.

Finally both the side accepted that their is a difference in perception of CPEC . Taller than mountain, deeper than ocean, sweeter than honey rhetoric can subsided and reality kicks in

The concept of ' Commercial Importers' should be abolished. First export then import of same amount. Automatically there will be no deficit.

It will be appropriate if learned Pakistani economist living and working in Western Countries should come forward and give their honest opinion on the CPEC. This way they will do a great service to the people of Pakistan.

"CPEC not responsible for Pakistan’s economic woes",China is responsible and the people who blindly believe China

Once all the job is done (by others) we start paying for the loans with interest on projects which are likely to provide no returns. Looking at this situation nobody will be willing to even give us loan. So its incorrect to say CPEC is not responsible for the current woes.

Explain this to gullibles. There are no takers for this explanation. The real reason Pakistan economy is in a mess is because 1) Foreign reserves depleted due to import of machinery from China. 2) Chinese laborers imported instead of Pakistani laborers 3) Special tax concessions for Chinese investors at the expense of local businessmen.

Nobody is talking about debt payments yet, which may start in future. That in itself is a different mess.

So the pti Government has been lying about this!

Economic growth rate of Pakistan will be higher in 2022 due to CPEC just like it became higher for other countries who took Chinese loans.

Chinese companies executing various CPEC projects would hire more Pakistani labour and mid-level managers.

This like investing money for which Pakistan has to pay interest and get bosses to manage the funds from China who would give bids only to Chinese companies so that profit margins of the Chinese companies can be further enhanced!

Basic of negotiation skill needs to be thought as main subject for all Pakistanis!

In that case none of the IMF money will go to China. Is that true?

Truth be told, it's China's world! Pakistan is now a Chinese colony, they can do whatever they want.

Prof. Sun asks what China is gaining from the energy projects. China supplies all equipment and does all construction work. This is the biggest cost element in a power project. This will have to be paid back by Pakistan. Equipment has not been purchased under competitive bidding. Chinese equipment is not the most efficient. But since there is no competitive bidding, the price, Pakistan is made to pay, is international price.

Looks like we are going to question the motives of one of the last two friends left in this world about our bilateral economic relations.

2023-2024 will be interesting year when Pakistan will start Chinese payments. Ladies and gentlemen get ready for a show.

Really ?

Yeah, everyone knows the folly behind. Heavy machinery imported by Pakistan from China for CPEC lead to high fiscal deficit. Situation will be worse while paying debt.

Three years period is when CPEC will see $3billion repayments per year and another 2-3 billion to IMF if Pakistan goes for a 3 year programme. What China should give is details of loans, investment, expected cash inflows,loan repayments which means a white paper on what is CPEC so that Pakistanis know where they stand. While even defence deals are discussed in democracies what is so secretive in a commercial project that can’t be told to Pakistanis who have voted a new Govt. Rest of the world inclg. IMF are requested for loans they also demand details as they have subscribed billions of dollars to IMF or ADB or World Bank.

Pakistan, welcome to the Chinese world of business. Hope you are enjoying Chinese fruit. Don't know if still time is there or not. But can try once again to improve the relationship with India and Afghanistan to revive the situation both financial and social.

No one can predict future growth. How can you growth will be higher ? what is the plan B if you can't pay ? Most of your resources will be owned by us as per sovereign guarantees.

--Panchasheela and Dr Kotnis spirit coming back with big bang.

All wise countries have got out or are in the processing of getting out of OBOR debt trap. However intellect is not everyone's strong point. Staying on the ground, instead of trying to go higher than Himalayas and deeper than the Seas would help.

Agree with the point of engaging more labor workers from Pakistan.in many projects more labor workers are engaged from China,which is an injustice to pakistani nation.

Yes. Even Hambotta port in Sri Lanka is not taken over by china. Tomorrow Chinese vacation I n hamborta port would be over and they are giving it back to Srilanka.

I agree with China that CPEC not responsible for Pakistan’s economic woes. Some money might have been spent on protection of Chinese workers. Pakistan had habit of surviving on aid and as soon as aid is stopped it has come to knees. Complete U turn is required in thinking and external policy, with business as priority. Otherwise doomsday for Pakistan will not be far away. Collapse may be earlier than repayment for CPEC loans starts.

so now after the complains the chinese have decided to hire more pakistani labourers? I think we need to re negotiate the whole spectrum of cpec. cpec may not be cause of debt presently, but it might be pre cursor to greater economic hardships in future. the repayments should be brought down to levels that future generations can afford easily.

Never trust anyone when it comes to business. There are no friends in business and diplomacy. I hope Pakistan people gets some relief from ongoing crisis.

Totally agree with the Chinese and apologize profusely for misinformation spread by certain sections in Pakistan, CPEC is the most important project in the history of the nation, which will transform our current growth rate at 3% to more than 12% within next year and leapfrog our economy to a 20t $ economy by 2020.

Chinese have done so much and doing much more without any profits in mind and all Pakistanis are very appreciative and remember that our relationship with China is sweeter than honey, higher than ozone and stronger than adamantium.

Wasn’t CPEC supposed to be investments and not loans? Hope IMF do their job and we finally get to know why CPEC agreements are so secretive.

Pakistan's economy was a mess long before CPEC.

Definitely not , Pakistan is facing this economic crisis , because of corruption. From politicians to bureaucrats everyone tried to looted this country.

It has begun! China is finally speaking up against all the controversy surrounding its benevolence for Pakistan. PTI is giving into the anti-China rhetoric being pushed by the likes of US. We should not give in.

Following are of note:

1. "What will China gain from energy projects given priority in the first phase of CPEC" Answer: China has lots to gain from the cost of financing on these projects. The professor forgot to mention the debt rate at which China is financing these projects.

2. "Mr An Qiguang announced that Chinese companies would hire more Pakistani labour and mid-level managers. Interpretation: So as of now they are importing labor and management from China. It is strange that these projects don't even hire Pakistani labor. And they have not made any commitments yet despite CPEC being under development for several years now.

3. "Zhizhong said that they would import more agriculture products from Pakistan to help reduce the trade imbalance between Islamabad and Beijing." Note: They say they "would" import from Pakistan., Have they made any commitments yet?

Final Comment: Read between the lines, not just the headline.

Interpretation: Again the

CPEC is not responsible for Pakistan’s economic woes. Not yet. Could be in future.

Truth is finally out.

Ok if cpec is soo good please make the deals public

China already had destroyed economy of many african countries and srilanka mangolia and next is pakistan which is heading towards the same.

China never a friend, a communist country who show no remorse for anyone forget about Uighurs.

CPEC though a good idea, has infact, become an epitome of lack of wisdom and 'how a thing should not be done', the way it has been implemented and effected. What caused such imprudence is a matter that should be investigated.

Pakistan illusion start to fade being a friend. If it still thinks China as iron brother, well good luck.

@FIDA SAYANI Mitan Atif will do ??

China’s help with power projects is not free. Pakistan needs power projects but cannot afford to borrow money for them without the capacity to pay them back and that is the issue. Needs and wants must comply with affordability. All dreams cannot be fulfilled if you don’t have the money in your pocket.

Everything was going fine under Nawaz sharif. Stock market was at 54,000 points and forex reserves were at $22 billion. Dollar was kept around Rs100 for 4.5 years. Electricity crisis was solved and security situation improved in Karachi and rest of Pakistan.

Despite all this Imran Khan kept trying to dislodge Govt via dharnas and eventually succeeded via undemocratic means.

Now he has no clue what to do.

@Hedonist : Yes, they will convert a part of the loans into grants by the time the repayments are due. Also, the PM is expected to garner atleast USD 5 Billion in aid during his visits to KSA, Malaysia, and ofcourse China. So the funding required from IMF will get substantially reduced.

China is not a Pakistan’s friend the way Pakistanis think. China is looking after their own good. They careless for Pakistan.

@Imtiaz Ali Khan

Please don't mind buddy .

But it's their hard earned money .

Don't cast an eye in their money .

They have well over a billion population to take care of and have done well by sheer hard work and blood and sweat .

Why should they provide grants .

Any country first takes care of it's own citizens .

Than why not even a single dollar remit to Pakistani Banks under CPEC ?

CPEC is second episode of Sandik Gold Project .

But the strange part is neither Pakistan nor China are talking about and willing to share the details of CPEC deals. That itself is highly suspicious. This is not a deal about some defense equipment purchase.

Then why all the secrecy surrounding CPEC? It is supposed to be a purely economic project, right?

Pakistan not knowledge about CPEC that this is the project which our country earn more and it takes benefits not only domestically but also international level.So,stop thinking negative and gives some time to this project

@Magnanimous approach You must be a non-science background person that i can deduce from your comment. ho does a e-car run without electricity that cant be generated through coal or gas, may be through lighting on the e-car.

CPEC has been established as game changer and so there is every attempt to sabotage it. Army has it all covered when they will create a border crisis with India and China will reward with finally writing-off the loans...

CPEC might have been success if many countries had joined in, particularly India. But since India refused to join for obvious reasons and other countries started smelling debt-trap and putting off, pakistan got trapped in debt. Corruption may have played part in present economic state of pakistan but cpec has contributed a lot that one cannot deny.

This the sign of first crack in Pak China friendship. It was ok until big words were used, now, with money matters, it’s shattering.

Now whatever, China will do and throw goodies, Pakistan will never be happy as its never in position to re-pay in the first place. Pakistan’s economic sickness starts with un-humanly change to its civilisation by adopting dessert cult - which is irreversible and irreparable. Only total distraction will bring back Indus Valley civilisation to its lost prosperity. However all this will happen in the next 10 years, along with Middle East loosing all of its oil exports to e-motors/e-cars. 10 more years - everyone will dump dessert cult and destroyed Pakistan will be the first one to do so.

China already charged interest for these loan. Chinese monies invested on dead investment not on a meaningful projects which can generate revenue. Roads will not generate revenue right know. What if they spent this monies to build industries so we can export a lot.

The simplest way of convincing people is to publish a honest income V/S expenditure projected for CPEC. I don;t believe just China alone pay billions to use the CPEC roads.

China is basically telling in clear terms that the present economic situation that has developed inside Pakistan is because of its own doing and policies adopted and heavy borrowings & inefficient past & present governance for last so many years and nothing to do with CPEC.

Chinese professor is trying make debt payment as a factor. But in reality debt payment is burden yet to come. The real derogatory effect of CPEC on Pak industeris has brought this huge fall in GDP growth rate, export causing foreign reserve to dry up. If you see CPEC roads they are connecting China industries with Pak markets and not Pak indutrial areas causing influx of chinese goods in Pak market in last few years. Dont trust me see the data import export of Pak govt. China has used its roads for destroying Pak industries first and debt will be used in acquiring natural resources, lands and ports of Pak. China voted against Pak in FATF because fall of Pak economy helps Chinese invasion plan.

'They would import more agriculture products from Pakistan to help reduce the trade imbalance between Islamabad and Beijing' How is this going to happen? Firstly with uncontrolled population in Pakistan whatever we grow in future will not be enough to feed local population and secondly will the Pakistani produce able to match the quality or price of Chinese produce?

The only problem is free flow of movement by Chinese nationals, their ability to purchase this fertile land with money, depriving the livelyhood of common people and destroying the natural habitate. If that is ok with us then why not.

Benefits of CPEC aside, country's wider interests appear to have been sacrificed by overzealous past rulers. Pakistan has become a dumping ground for Chinese products. Advisor to PM on commerce has rightly pointed out that even a ladder used in one of the power plants was imported from China.

CPEC is not responsible but those signed the deal without reading it are......

@Hedonist Excellent idea!

I don't understand these 2 things If any Pakistani here can explain will appreciate 1) USSR in Afghanistan wanted to "reach warm waters" and was a "threat that had to be defeated" 2) China, another communist country, wants to use Pakistan to also reach "garam paani" and this will transform Pakistan into "rivers of milk and honey" Why so different perspectives ?

Interesting thing about CPEC- no other country is going to use it as nothing flows into China from out side world. It means, only Chinese are only going to use these project for their transport. Pakistan locally never needed it, and if she did, she could have built it in phases, based on the needs. So now, it's Pakistan's land and resources are being used for China's exports, for which China is lending money at a higher interest rates!!!! Even if Chinese exports reduces, China is going to get it's investment back as it's a loan. So in any condition ultimate looser is Pakistan. If Chinese exports through CPEC reduces, infra will be of no use, lying around, but Pakistan will still have to repay the loans without real commercial use of these infra!! Amazing model.

True face of china. Only business no friendship

CPEC has resulted in Pakistan getting entangled in a spiralling debt trap. Pakistan was better of in the American Camp.

CPEC is one of the major causes of Pakistan’s economic woes, though not the only one. There are other causes also

Pakistan needs 12 billion$. China has foreign reserves of 3500 billion$. China can easily bail out Pakistan, if it is truly an iron brother

CPEC has also led to the sovereignty of Pakistan being seriously compromised. I am seriously worried as a patriotic Pakistani

I seriously feel mending fences with India is the safe and easiest way out of all Pakistani economic woes

Wise man don't put all his egg in one basket. Pakistan should borrow funds for infra need from international institutions Viz imf, adb, jica etc not from any commercial international banks. Abolish your thinking that within a span of next 5-10 years you will become developed country. Since it is an ongoing process. Every country has its own challenges and advantages. So better analyse it and allocate your national budgetary resources in challages area. Don't take any investment decisions based on perspective that it will boost our friendship with all weather friend or it will harm our number 1 enemy. Investment decisions should be based on one and only Pakistan prosperity.

Do you think China will accept facts?

Pak should not depend on china they have the ability to become strong economy

@Real salaria Yes, they have.

When China funds any project - it ensures the project construction is executed by Chinese companies. It also ensures all materials and equipment are purchased from China. This ensures business for Chinese. Now what does Pakistan gain??? Pakistan only gain debt. If China is a genuine friend then it must ensure all materials and project execution is done by Pakistani companies.

@ali

Get help

Why are all these sudden negativity about CPEC after the highly emotional praise up until now? Holding ones nerve and not plunge into extremes of course is essential in international dealings. Demands and requests to China to write off CPEC loans are undignified. A proud nation and its people pay their way, not beg half way down the contract. CPEC will bring the necessary changes, be positive and patient.

So Nawaz Sharif regime has to explain where hefty amount of loan was used during those years they ruled. Thanks to IK lifting the lid. Now we understand why you’ve asked ministers and bureaucrats to find out projects where billions of dollars of loan was used. Were those hidden projects belong to land and properties purchasing in Europe and America? Public needs to know now.

Hedonist : You have to work hard to earn what PMLN, PPP and other government officials have looted. China being good friend does not mean to waive of debts.

Whatever Chinese may say, CPEC for providing connectivity to Western China to Indian Ocean.All other things are secondary. The by--products of the project are: 1) China gets a transport grid through the heart of Pakistan.2) It can move large columns of army any time it wants and takeover Pakistan 3) By providing thermal power plants it gets rid of old coal based inefficient power plants from its grid and replace them with ultra modern ones 4) Employment is generated for Chinese engineers and workers in Pakistan . What more does it want?

@Imtiaz Ali Khan That is not how international relations work. Don’t expect China to waive off even 1 cent loan given to Pakistan as grant or something. The Chinese will extract every penny , ruthlessly if need be

I do not understand why this news is circulating. China has noting to do with trade deficit. Our previous leaderships are responsible for not fixing the economy. They had been looting revenue and the money had been sent out of the country illegally. It is high time to put looters in jail and ask them to pay back the money. Road taxes on vehicles under CPEC will cover much of the cost and duty on Chines exports through Pakistan should be imposed. There is a win win situation. Pakistanis should be employed on different CPEC projects. Let PM Imran Khan sort it our with Chinese.

I am unable to understand why Indians are so obsessed with CPEC and Chinese loans. Pakistan is an independent country and not part of india since 1947. we will do what we want and need. I am sure we never asked any help from your country and will never ask in future. comments given by Indians make me feel that Pakistan will become part of india again and they would have to pay these loans. believe me it would never happen.

The louder the protestations from the Chinese and Pakistan, the greater the doubts in the minds of observers. Why the financial details of various projects under CPEC were not revealed at the time of signing of Agreements, has never been adequately explained. The stink is so putrid and strong its stench is carrying over thousands of miles.

@Hedonist : China is not true friend, China is true business country. So please forget that they are going to wave off Pakistan due.

Regards

how would we repay in 23-24 , do we have any plan

China is right, CPEC debts has not even began, todays condition of Pakistan is past working of various Pakistani Govt, CPEC is just 3 years old.

I have written many times to Dawn many times, that China is for the Chinese and no else, they have sib-standard products and they sold Pakistan what is being banned in China, like Coal powered power plants, the manufacturers of such plants are government owned companies, yjey needed out side fools to buy such plants, coal mining in Shanxi is going bankrupt or sell very little in rural China, get mux of countries involved in development of Pakistan little by little.

@Hedonist - A true friend , a good Doctor, Parents and a True teacher would give you a bitter medicine, a slap and good advise rater than giving you sugar coated betrayal. Pakistan is a self respecting country and can not beg. Pakistan's riches are stored away by its past politicians and officials, we should first try to bring that in.

Hiring more Pakistani labour and mid-level managers is not enough. Greater economic transparency, open public dialogs and advantages / risks analysis is needed while selecting potential projects and their prioritization. Tenders should be open, competitive and transparent to ensure best value. Some participation from local companies, to start with, working towards increasing project responsibilities (for local companies) should be taken in account to transfer know-how and build local expertise which will help in ongoing development of the country.

@Zak "China can easily bail out Pakistan, if it is truly an iron brother" My true brother will not bail me out from my past follies, since he was showing me how to work while I was living luxurious life on loans. A true brother will force me to live within my means. Your concept of a true iron brother is different.

If Pakistan is looking for free money without serious questioning then Chinese are not the right people. For a long time we milked the USA for money and China for secret technology. Things are different now. Chinese will give everything but free money.

So till 2023 you will be debted to IMF and after that to both China and IMF.I can see pakistan in circular debt and on top of that there is no hope of any improvement.All these debts will make life difficult for ordinary people.Politicians,generals, bureaucrats who are dual nationals they will run away as soon as situation gets tough only common man suffers.Even IMF money has a limit on % a country borrows.If pakistan touches that limit it will be free fall of economy.Atleast venezuala,Russia and Iran has oil what do u have to survive?

I am sure PMIK on his visit to China, will convince them to convert $ 60 Billion of CPEC loan as grant. Also he may try for 15 Billion additional grant for this crisis. Pak-China friendship is for ever. long live this friendship.

@Harmony-1© "CPEC has resulted in Pakistan getting entangled in a spiralling debt trap." Did China force you to take loans? Can you explain the modalities under which someone can FORCE someone to to take loans? Your concept of economics is mind boggling, no wonder you find yourself in trouble. Loan can never be imposed on an unwilling borrower. You ask loans either to cover your previous loans or losses, or to finance a project that you find beneficial in the future. In no way a new lender can be held responsible for your previous loans or losses. It is your leaders who approached China for loans, not the other way round.

@Karim "True face of china. Only business no friendship". You have better friends in US and India and middle east, China is not stopping you contact them. They ask you to do more.

The main cause of all problems is lack of skills and production, which is because the primary identity is religion. There is no pride and reward in hard work or performance. It is better and easier to feel great by claiming to be a religious expert. Only that it doesn't help the county or economy.

Well we appreciate China's investment but in most projects only chinese companies are executing the projects, there are a few companies from Pakistan are getting its benefits. So there should be an absolute balance of manpower from Pakistan and China. ???? ????

@Dawood Waraich "China is looking after their own good. " Do they stop you from looking after your own good? Are US and India looking after your own good?

@Imtiaz Ali Khan "China who has amassed Trillions of dollars and we have 12 billion deficit with China that needs to be sorted out." Go ask help from India and US.

I deal with Chinese everyday for business reasons. If they even slightly smell their profits dipping they will come back very strong at you. They arent wrong in it as well. so mid level back out from any project by pakistan will backfire.

@Hedonist there is never a free lunch. Not even between brothers

Still in denial ... ???

well its time the pakistani economy crashes...only then will they realize reality

CPEC is not responsible for economic woes at present but CPEC will be responsible for economic woes for future generations to come.

@Hedonist Will you wave off debts due to friendship?

Now, Chinese are speaking of Loan, Then where is the investment???

CPEC is all about trade and connectivity. China can use CPEC to further it's trade and connectivity. How will Pakistan further it's trade and connectivity when it has bad relationship with all it's neighbours and cannot produce anything because China is killing all the industry in Pakistan. Future generations of Pakistan will live under Chinese occupation in Chinese debt.

@Zak In international relations there is no brother and sister. Even in a family, it's seldom that a rich brother gives free money to his sibling.

There should not be any loans, rather it should be all investments from China and Pakistan should take major share from revenue generated since China is using Pakistani routes. Where did loans come from and why? Loans for giving benefits to the lender is the worst deal ever. Chinese know this well and deep inside they know no other sane country would agree to such foolish agreements. Pakistan needs to act fast and preserve its economic interests as well as friendship with China. IK and Asad Umar need to look into this ASAP. Asad Umar should know as ex-CEO of Engro that loans were taken to benefit primarily Engro and not the lenders. In this case China is not only a lender but also a beneficiary so there should not be any loans. China should invest while Pakistan provide routes and both share the revenue.

No one or any country does favours for another for free. It does not matter who or who is not an all weather friend as no one is when it comes to wealth and money. These advisers and professors to presidents can only look at situations from their own advantage view point first then offer the scape to others. We should be doing our own development. It may take longer but in the long run it is better for the country.

@Imtiaz Ali Khan Like most of us Pakistanis you are deluding yourself. We don't need Chinese or China. We have to be self reliant and innovate ourselves. Dependency on another state is unsafe.

No doubts CPEC is a very useful project both for China and Pakistan however the agreement should be reviewed to make it equally beneficial for both the countries. The duration of lease for 99 years may be shortened and the profit rate 91% for China and 9 % for Pakistan is irrational and needs revision.

@Rajesh " In international relations there is no brother and sister. Even in a family, it's seldom that a rich brother gives free money to his sibling." Absolutely correct, and that is how it should be. If you are looking for hand outs, you're not looking for friends, but donors. So you can just qualify as needy, not a friend. Beggars cannot be friends of those they beg from.

CPEC is just a smokescreen. If one thinks clearly, it is about building infrastructure - which PAKISTAN doesn't need, to transport products - which PAKISTAN doesn't manufacture and to sell it to consumers - which PAKISTAN doesn't have. So what is behind this smokescreen? Your guess is as good as mine.

What else do you expect China's representative to say?

If Chinese are true friend of Pakistanis, they should waive the CPEC loan and provide USD 20 billion aid to Pakistan to help friends in overcoming from the current financial crisis.

@Zak Yes, China having over USD 3 trillions in foreign ex. reserve, which is also growing continuously, can easily bail-out Pakistan as USD 12 B is just pocket change. But, China is not USA to give grants and aids, and also know that Pakistan will later behave like they behaved with USA and would also waste the cash on military spending resulting in unrest in the region. Pakistan should convince China that they will do everything to reign in their good terrorists and will create an atmosphere of peace inside and also in the immediate region. Why China is looking to India for partnership in Afghanistan, if they are confident of Pakistan creating an atmosphere of peace with its neighbours. Why should China waste their hard-earned money, but still ready to invest by giving loan and also executing various projects, which they think Pakistan is not equipped with. Any investor will expect return on the investment as profit and interest on the loan. Still there is 5 years to start to repay.

@Zak China is also sitting on $ 5800 b loan. So they must have that much of reserve to control the second biggest economy of the world.

@Rohail Some money transfer from the all weather friend may help to silence the public posturing of current boss. Anyway, the brunt will be faced by someone 4-5 years down the line, as revealed by the all weather friend. I will be happy if proven wrong.

We know CPEC is not responsible for our economic woes. It is the Corruption Mafias and those granting them safe passage and NROs at their discretion who are really responsible for where we stand as a nation.

Question is not about who is responsible for this mess! Question is what China can do to get Pakistan out of this mess.

@Zak : It is a good idea if both China and saudi,each donate 5 billion dollars annually as our budget supplement..

Every country has economic corridors. Even very poor African nations have it. Economic development depends on many things one of which is a corridor. Having a corridor does not ensure economic success.

CPEC must be renamed as CEC ie China Economic Corridor as 99% of the benefit goes in favour of China. Here Pakistan role is just as caretaker. The biggest problem before Pakistan is they do not want to upset all weathered friend knowing that China is taking undue advantage from it most trusted friend in this region. Chinese must have given soft loan with low interest rate for a longer period as Japan has given to India. Here the rate of interest is just 0.1% and can be paid in 40 years.

Why not the fiscal deficit is brought under CPEC? NS was bringing everything under it, why can not IK?

They are right. You need to read the loan terms and equity vs loan ratios in the project conducted. Its more about the 17 years of war impacting Pakistan.

@Imtiaz Ali Khan As long as a nation lives on grants and handouts progress is going to be painfully slow. China will never convert loans to grants without ropes attached with which they can hang Pakistan when they wish.

China is right here, it's unsustainable defense expendature brought Pakistan in to this state of economy. Sorry but nobody can see this in Pakistan. Cut defense budget to mare 2.5 % and make it public. Why it is not made publlic?

China is right. CPEC is not the reason for current economic woes of Pakistan. However, it may become a major reason if Pakistan fails to repay all the loans availed from China.

@Mrs.khalil Please add to that the overwhelming and disproportionate defence to development ratio in allocating budgetary funds.

I agree with Chinese observation. There is no concern with CPEC. Only issue remain with execution. The government must not loose focus and try to internally negotiate with China instead of going to IMF. The Chinese love us, they will listen.

@Zak You are a true optimist.

Surprising to read the thoughts of friends from Pakistan. Even after 70 years, they still want to depend upon someone. Will there be an end to dependency?. But they talk as if they are a superpower. I am not saying you need to bow your head, but take a realistic view of the country and way forward.

West side of China has only 5% of the population and very little industrialization. CPEC is a good way to revitalize China's slowing construction economy because their internal cities have been mostly built or the rate of expansion has declined. China has excess capacities in many of the new ports like Fuzhou, Xiamen, and others. Why would these ports give up their business and use another 3000 miles ground route to export? They will fight and compete with CPEC. The benefits of CPEC will only come when west side of China sees heavy industrialization or in a war situation when China is cut off from read sea. Hence, the revenue stream will be slow to come. However, its up to Pakistan to create JVs with China and use the CPEC infrastructure for export to China or central Asia. Use the Chinese model of learning, copying and displacing Chinese companies to handle more projects with local companies.

As per the news Jiangsu’s Deputy Secretary General Wang Zhizhong said that they would import more agriculture products from Pakistan which means we need to better in agriculture as China only wants our agri products or (may be value added products). Obviously we cannot match in technology and innovation with china and other countries.

But the Chinese scholar has to answer about the economic difficulties being faced by SriLanka and Malaysia and now Nepal. Why the SriLankans had to give their port to China in lieu of the loans which they could not pay back. Similar situation may happen to Malsysia as a result Malaysia has curtailed some projects being financed by Chinese. It is natural for Pskistan to get skeptic about this project,

@Nasir things change when u have courage to complain

Just one question, Rise in imports (just double) due to the CPEC is not part of the problem & why it was not taken under consideration earlier

China is Pakistan's one real friend. The problem is that the amount of CPEC projects is counted as sovereign debt by other agencies. That means the nation's debt-to-GDP ratio is affected by this even if repayments do not start now.

Pakistan's mistake was allowing use of Chinese workers in building CPEC. If it was a gift, fine, but it was a loan. So the project should have generated many more jobs. Bad negotiators.

@mahim "Pak should not depend on china they have the ability to become strong economy" Pakistan is just planning to take maximum benefit from the CPEC, not planning to depend on China or anyone else. The ruling lot doesn't know how to survive without dependence on someone though. This is the reason Pakistan finds itself unable to maximize its benefit, but just asking loans and gifts from them. In order to benefit from CPEC, Pakistan will need to change the ruling lot, not the CPEC modalities. CPEC will go ahead whether Pakistan takes benefit or not

@Imran "how would we repay in 23-24 , do we have any plan" You need to ask this question to your "visionary" leaders who present themselves as geniuses and you accept them as such. Have they ever repaid their own loans?

Hedonist "If China is a true friend of Pakistan, it should waive off debts given to Pakistan". Why should they?. Why would China help out in future if current loan is not paid?. Will your friend give his money to you and not expect it back?

@Raja Hindustani "Question is what China can do to get Pakistan out of this mess." I took a loan from a bank by pledging my house and now am in a mess. So for you, it is the bank's responsibility to get me out of the mess. Can you tell us where have you learned banking? It must be fun there.

Now, we are seeing the true color of china. When is Pakistan going to learn...?

Tbh this China Cpec all stinks - difficult to say whether it’s propganda by the Indians and Americans or whether it’s genuinely profitable. But I would not burn any bridges with China and review all current projects. The very least China can do is to list all the projects they have underway with Pakistan.

Well better start learning and teaching mandarin to your next generation. You people are going to need it

@Zak Yes you are right China got lots of spare money, but can Pakistan afford to pay the interest rates that China will demand? China is in business and they will not lend the money free or discounted rate. Try and test the Iron friend.

@Rajesh " How will Pakistan further it's trade and connectivity when it has bad relationship with all it's neighbours and cannot produce anything because China is killing all the industry in Pakistan." The "bad relations" with neighbors is because of the trade and connectivity potential. This is how geopolitics works. Good relations means having understanding on major issues, bad relations means lack of it. It can always be worked out though, but it takes two to tango. It is as much an issue for Pakistan as it is for its neighbors, you won't be commenting if it was not.

@Sab Se Pehle Pakistan who is said CPEC is not responsible for Pakistan problems? Repeat the word again you will get the answer .

How Pakistan got into this big mess. Why Pakistani ministers did not calculate each of projects whether it will generate enough money to pay the debt and make any profits for people of Pakistan.It is under stable that one minister can make a mistake but not whole government.

True colors of China emerging.

@Zak Hats off to you...!!!

they why China more interested in CPEC?? and being termed as flagship project or dream project of Chinese Premier !!

China never does anything for free or anything which is not beneficial to her .. !!

How does it look when you have an iron brother sitting over trillions of dollars, and your prime minister is going from pillar to post requesting mere 12 billion $?

CPEC not responsible for Pakistan’s economic growth, says China

China is a true friend of Pakistan we must trust them.

This lopsided deal where China is taking away 91% of the profit, carrying out execution of projects through Chinese contractor at 50% more cost that market, not paying high security costs of its workers during execution & beyond, importing duty free equipment and machinery, getting land for proposed warehouses at negligible cost, restricting inclusion of local companies in construction & others, is a source of anxiety for those who want to know more details of this agreement to ward off fears of repeat of Hambantota port in Sri Lanka. Unless details of CPEC, which for all practical purposes will make our future generations hostage of repayment of this huge loan, is not taken out from shrouds of secrecy & made transparent showing an equitable dispensation, such opposition is likely to continue unabated. The PTI which was making hue & cry, when it was in opposition, being in power & should not be hesitant to take the rabbit out of the hat. All must be taken on board for CPEC’s success

This is bad news. The biggest repayment is not yet due.. and already such a financial mess. In 2023-24, it will be really between the vice.. Unless pakistan actually makes use of the CPEC to really export something of value.

Well done IK. We must get the maximum out of the CPEC both in short term and long term. In short term we must make sure China employs people from Pakistan whereever possible.

Why any country has Hugh trade deficits with China? Just because nobody produces as much at as Low price as China. How can you reduce trade deficit: only if you stop purchasing from China; which means either cut your needs of buy more expensive from some other country. Moreover if you have huge Chinese debt it’s a Hugh sinkhole in which many country have washed away.

@Zak, there is no friendship in business.

China is only partially responsible but the previous govt is actually guilty for signing on a blank paper and CPEC agreement then drafted by China on the same.

How many Pakistanis are lining up everyday outside Chinese Embassy Vs US embassy to get an immigrant visa? Does Iron Brother even grant any immigrant visa. Way Muslims are treated in China, would any Muslim would want to immigrate to China?

@Hedonist with all due respect even brothers do not forgive loans amongst each other.

@FIDA SAYANI "t will be appropriate if learned Pakistani economist living and working in Western Countries should come forward and give their honest opinion on the CPEC"

You should say 'non-ahmadiya" pakistani economists..

Actually lavish import policies to spend more dollars was the target of Nawaz govt. If we see the records, the imports of different non wanted items boosted without looking into consequences. These increases drastically started in 2013 at 45 billion dollars and were at its highest in July 2018 at about 55 billion dollars whereas exports decrease from 25 billions in 2013 to 19 billions in 2018. Bengal dean's imports remained same and exports increased from 30 billions to 38 billion dollars in 2018. Their currency remain at 80 whereas ours decreased to dollar from 105 to 134. There was no reactions from Pakistani bureaucracy towards the political govt to ask to limit this.

China was and is Pakistan's friend. It has always been and anybody who says it isn't ; please stay silent. CPEC has been a much awaited project for Pakistan since its inception. Long live China- Pak friendship

A year back, the reading was different, Pakistan was thinking its going to be superpower and inviting countries to join CPEC. Sorry your neighbors knew more about CPEC than yourself.

Our Indian friends think that CPEC is bad for Pakistan. This in itself is a strong argument in favour of CPEC project. Indians like everything that damages Pakistan. There comments against CPEC means they anticipate that this project will be beneficial for Pakistan and they don't want this.

we know that, we very well know that

'CPEC not responsible for Pakistan’s economic woes, says China'

China is right. Hope CPEC is a good project for Pakistan.If not, blame Pakistani politicians not CPEC

Terms in Gwadar port revenue is 91% China will take away and 9% Pakistanis will get

One thing is confirmed that China is not an all weather friend of Pakistan. So start looking else where. In order to survive in this world, you need to have multiple friends. If Pak starts good relationship with India, they will grow economically.

Everyone said CPEC is a game changer. Looks like the game has changed now

"Loan repayments for the China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) projects will start in the financial year 2023-24"...the real disaster for pak will start then. This is just a trailer.

@Zak Can please explain your statement further, how CPEC will create 20T $ economy> You said " CPEC is the most important project in the history of the nation, which will transform our current growth rate at 3% to more than 12% within next year and leapfrog our economy to a 20t $ economy by 2020." How this will happen, the World Bank nor any banks has forcasted this huge jump. Even China has not mention this fiqure.

CPEC serves the chines needs than that of pakistan but its the people of the land who need to bear the full cost of CEPC,anyway better than having nothing to have something.

@Rashid, It's not only Indians.. also read what IMF, WB and other financial institutions are saying about CPEC.

@Zak. " transform our current growth rate at 3% to more than 12% within next year and leapfrog our economy to a 20t $ economy by 2020"

Do you know what Trillion $ means? Your extreme sense of optimism is stronger than anyone's wildest dreams.

CPEC is an good initiative taken for Pakistan! Atleast it will fix the ongoing power issues on Pakistan. Hope India understands and joins CPEC which will benefit millions of people.

@Zak - OK. Hallucination is no good. Pakistan will get 12% and how much will China get? Any idea?

China is right. CPEC repayments have not yet even started and Pakistan is already in trouble due to cheap Chinese goods flooding Pakistan markets

The Chinese are right, we can't blame CPEC for our economic woes in Pakistan. These are mostly of our own making over 70 years of mismanagement and wasteful expenditures.

I agree with Professor Sun. Pakistan will benefit from CPEC for sure. Top agenda is to overcome electricity crisis. Critics in this blog are those who have built dams on rivers and and want to create water shortage to suffocate Pakistan. PM Imran Khan should focus on producing cheap energy based on the latest technique and not based on fuel and coal. Otherwise, it will be a total waste of money and resources. China values friendship and it is right of China to demand payments on its investments. That is a deal.

@RAI In recent months, export to China has increased tremendously. People sitting across the border knows nothing. They are keep typing, typing.................................... and typing only.

@Pakistani Yes Pakistan should go ahead with CPEC project and it will become world biggest exporter (after all when you spend 60 billion for infrastructure you need to export at least 100 billion a year to start) and then it will become no2 to China. Pakistan and China will rule the world for couple of centuries. Also China being an iron brother will write off the debt of 60billion.

@Rajput I don't think by then Pakistan will be able to repay.

Loan repayment to start in 2023 - 24? By then we all will be very well off to pay off the loans...

Only CPEC related topic can attracts thousands of Indians comments

only country in the whole world could not recognized china's policy. even Srilanka backed off.

All those nations , who took Chinese Loan for OBOR project are seriously in debt trap. Sri Lanka , Djibouti, Tajikistan, Kenya, all are victim of chinese debt trap.

No, the Chinese cannot be blamed for the current economic vows, not today any way. Now, if the deals are renegotiated and redone, it would potentially add a lot more debt to the already mountainous numbers.

yes it will release grief of Pakistan upto some good limit Inshallah...

Ask China how come belt and road is China's ambition but you are responsible for its full cost in Pakistan with interest and guaranteed profits. It's their plan but you borrow and you pay?

China is busy installing latest solar electricity plants in China but selling obsolete technology to Pakistan at high prices and guaranteed returns of over 15%.

Renegotiate now to cut all the debt down. Walk out of trap. It's now or never.

@brr Cheap labor is what we will provide. The contract is like Mortgage. Their eyes are on cotton, Marble and livestock.

@Najum Any prospective study as to how much profitability we will have in 2019, and 2024.

@Gaurav Contract is called ""Build on Transfer"' What exports we will be hauling to Gowadar.?

@Zak It is not aid - sort of deferment of loan. Aid implies no repayment.

sure sure

So some who are important enough for China to respond do not feel so.

@Hedonist : China is interested in making money and does not care about any country including pakistan....