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Did Kerry snub Islamabad?

Published Jun 26, 2013 05:47pm


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US Secretary of State John Kerry.—Photo by AP
US Secretary of State John Kerry.—Photo by AP

ISLAMABAD: The official spokesperson of US State Department in Washington may not like to describe John Kerry skipping a visit to Islamabad as a snub to Pakistani leaders, but that is how it is largely being perceived in Islamabad.

Islamabad was initially part of US Secretary of State’s itinerary, but at a later stage US officials said that due to unexpected developments in Syria, he would not be proceeding to Pakistan. This was unexpected for Pakistan’s political leadership, including Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, as they were ready to have their first direct contact with a senior US administration official after coming to power in the May 11 general elections.

“We were expecting to discuss a wide range of talk, not just Afghanistan,” said a senior official of the new government in Islamabad.

Some of the foreign ministry officials tried to explain Kerry’s not coming to Pakistan by saying that he was expected a much larger agenda of talks in Islamabad and for why he needed more time.

Pakistan’s hopes were pinned on the expectations that the visit of the US Secretary of State will lead to a revival of the Pak-US strategic dialogue, which has been stalled since the Abottabad raid that killed Osama Bin Laden and led to much acrimony between the two countries.

The government still hopes that the strategic dialogue could be revived on Kerry’s next trip to Pakistan, but sources told Dawn.Com there was little chance of John Kerry visiting Islamabad in the near future.

Pakistani officials see Kerry’s continued engagement on Afghanistan throughout his Asia trip as a particular snub, with Pakistan being ignored throughout this time.

There is a view in Islamabad that Americans will come back to Pakistan for help when the Afghan situation gets to a crucial stage. “They (Americans) will come back to Islamabad for help on Afghanistan. They need us there,” said former Foreign Secretary Shamshad Ahmed Khan.

However, the most recent ‘snub’ was particularly noted in Islamabad, especially after Kerry acknowledged a greater role for India in bringing stability and democracy to Afghanistan.

In a speech in New Delhi, John Kerry said that India has a central role to play in ensuring free and fair elections in Afghanistan, scheduled to take place in April next year.

In his meetings with Indian officials, Kerry directly briefed them about the peace initiative with the Taliban and told media that a senior US diplomat would be visiting New Delhi in the coming days to brief them on the latest development in the Doha talks.

The US Secretary of State visited New Delhi as part of a visit to the Middle East and South East Asia.

Officially, it was stated that he was skipping Islamabad because he got too busy because of the latest developments in Syria. But then he landed in New Delhi and discussed Afghanistan with the Indian leadership.

Throughout his Middle East and South East Asia trip, Kerry remained engaged on Afghanistan. In Washington, the State department spokesman said that it was not meant as a ‘cold shoulder’ to the Pakistani leadership.

He went to Doha and New Delhi and in each station he discussed Afghanistan and the latest peace initiative with the Afghan Taliban. While he was still on the Asia trip, Kerry even spoke twice to Afghan President Hamid Karazai and tried to convince him to join the peace talks.

Analysts say that there was no public reaction from Pakistan on this particular situation primarily because Islamabad has realised during the past two years that the US has decided to give greater ascendency to India in Afghanistan and this is now an ‘old story’ in Islamabad.

“Americans have in the past few years given much ascendency to India in Afghanistan and it is going to be a big problem for us in the coming years,” said former Foreign Secretary Shamshad Ahmed Khan.

Experts believe that Kerry’s assertions in New Delhi represent the public acknowledgement of that greater role.

Khan said that this particular statement does not mean much. “Ensuring free elections means Indians will train them in electoral exercise,” he said.

However, the real concern in Islamabad is that India may get the opportunity to train the Afghan security forces.

In the past two years, Pakistani security officials have told Americans in talks that Pakistan does not want an unstable force on its border, which can turn to drug smuggling and internal strife when the Americans leave.

When some sections of the Pakistani media noted that the US Secretary of State deliberately skipped Islamabad, US diplomacy immediately went into an overdrive of damage control.

The US ambassador told a group of journalists in Islamabad that Pakistan has a central role in paving the way for Doha talks.

Similarly, officials said that the US Special Representative on Afghanistan, James Dobbins in his meetings with Pakistani officials, did not repeat any of the harsh US demands that the Pakistani leadership has faced during the past few years.

Comments (134) Closed

ashraf a jamal Jun 26, 2013 06:10pm

Pakistan should ask Afghanistan to take back 15 million refugees back. Plus America should pay damages for misplacing them. Pakistan should intercept American's drone and expel FBI and CIA personal.

sanjay mittal Jun 26, 2013 06:25pm

As a well wisher of Pakistan, I wish Pakistan gets its act straight in Afghanistan.

Does it welcome a Taliban sort of government there, thinking that one day Afghanistan would be part of a bigger Pakistan? Well if it does, then it is being stupid. In the end, Afghanistan will get Pakistan... and not vice versa. After All the Taliban using militant Islam will target Paksitani democracy and whip up so much trouble that it will start a parallel Islamic fundamentalist movement in Pakistan.

It is best to help Hamid Karzai or a successor take on the fundos and the militants. In fact Pakistan should join India in making Afghanistan democratic.

Md Imran Jun 26, 2013 06:25pm

Convoluted logic by John Kerry. This is what happens when people don't learn from history. Pakistan has always been the leader of ummah and remain so. There is no need to involve UAE or Qatar when it comes to negotiating any sort of agreement in a muslim country, especially a muslim country neighbouring Pakistan.

As for imagining that India can do anything in Afghanistan is a fallacy. Afghans realize the magnanimity of the generosity that Pakistanis have displayed towards them in the past 22years. The only way for a settlement in Afghanistan is to allow Pakistan play a lead role. US should also allow Pakistan to dictate its own destiny when it comes to Kashmir without any interventions. The core issue has been India's stubborness when it comes to handing over Kashmir. Once that issue is resolved, the region can expect peace and prosperity.

pathanoo Jun 26, 2013 06:36pm

I can tell my Pakistani friends to relax. Your capacity for trouble making is far greater than India's capacity to handle it, specially with America gone from Afghanistan. Without Pakistan's sincere efforts Afghanistan will never be stable. The "Catch 22" is that without stable Afghanistan, Pakistan will never be at peace and can never prosper. It behooves both, India and Pakistan, to be sensible and do the right thing by Afghanistan there by helping themselves as well.

shoukat sheikh Jun 26, 2013 06:40pm

when will Pakistani army and civil goverment lean a lesson. This is the 2nd time Pakistan has put everthing on line and America has walk away. This time time around the impact of war on terror has been devatating rto Pakistn 9thank you Musharf). Now America is in bed with India again.

If Pakistani people wants freedom form US the they need to pay texaes, and ask for army to cut down expense.

Tanvir Jun 26, 2013 06:58pm

Answer to the question: Yes.

malick Jun 26, 2013 07:13pm

Pakistan cheating America, hence America is loving India. Mr Shamshad is respectable but he is not forwarding any right solution. First of all America will not be fully out of Afghanistan. Let us think America can afford to leave whole equipment and arm or can destroy there itself but does not ask any safe passage through Pakistan what will happen. America can live without any support of Pakistan. Mr Shamshad please do not mislead the country.

Imran Jun 26, 2013 07:19pm

India shares no borders with Afghanistan and no amount of snubbing can change that. All we have to do is wait.

Nizamuddin Ahmad Jun 26, 2013 07:31pm

Obviously Mr. Kerry is looking an alternative sources called India. This is logic. There is a old saying " deserve and then desire ". Entire government has been a bunch of clowns in the past and present, namely Zardari, Musharaf, Zia, Ayub Khan and now Sharif.

rohan Jun 26, 2013 07:38pm

He didnt come to pakistan because he knew that pakistanis will again beg for money and nothing else.

Anuj Jun 26, 2013 08:26pm

Let us look at the perspective from a US standpoint.

On winning the elections, what were the 2 key statements made on the Pakistan-US relationship by the PML(N)? 1.Pakistan's newly elected winner calls for an end to US Drone strikes as they disrespect Pakistan. 2.PML(N) head and future PM in waiting Nawaz Sharif wants US to respect Pakistan's sovereignty and control attacks from Afghan side of the border.

It was something which the watching Obama administration may have felt was a "showing the Bird to US" moment after the newly elected victors made their first statements after declaring victory.

There wasno motion passed or speech made on deepening relations, making better relationships with the US.

Just a grandstanding to the mob which loves it if Pakistan bloodies American noses...or so the newly elected politicos must have thought.

I would assume that the US reaction, which was completely absent to these comments, may have somewhat manifested in the itinerary planned for kerry, otherwise known in the US senate as a Pakistani backer, a Friend of Pakistan.

Now, should the Pakistanis try and understand this viewpoint, or just keep seeing their own navel / viewpoint when questioned?????

Ahmad Jun 26, 2013 08:30pm

Time to speed up Gawadar and Iran Gas projects to counter their snubbing. These are oppotunities we should never miss to distance ourselves from unipolar policies.

mehmood bhanji Jun 26, 2013 08:37pm

Pakistan is a drain on resources, reputation, ethics want to us but always gets used. US does not want to renew lease every day and pay increase. Get our own house together first and then you will see flow of everthing it is that simple.

Haroon Rashid Khan Jun 26, 2013 08:46pm

Diplomatic sources told Business Recorder on Tuesday that the US Secretary of State was unwilling to make a public statement with respect to halting US drone strikes in Pakistan, which would have embarrassed the newly elected government. (reported by business recorder)

Amjad Wyne Jun 26, 2013 09:27pm

Why should a US diplomat focus on Pakistani leaders that are themselves focused on, of all the things, how to prosecute Musharraf. If Pakistani leaders cannot focus on Pakistan's problems than US certainly has no reason to delve into anything that could be of value to Pakistan. The best advice anyone can offer to the Pakistani leadership is to suggest - please wake up and focus on the nation.

JP Singh Jun 26, 2013 09:43pm

However, the real concern in Islamabad is that India may get the opportunity to train the Afghan security forces.

In the past two years, Pakistani security officials have told Americans in talks that Pakistan does not want an unstable force on its border, which can turn to drug smuggling and internal strife when the Americans leave.

If you read this it appears that the Indians will train them to be drug smugglers..... like wise the Pakistanis will train them to be terrorists as we Indians think and rightly so. Even before the shit hit the fan Afghan Officers were trained in India. They trust India more than Pakistan. Pakistan for a change should stop playing the Islamic card and stop expecting that everything in the region should be according to their line of thinking -- a thinking that has gone horribly wrong. It seems Pakistan is too self indulgent in its thinking. Possibly because of the military thinking, which has led to the present state of affairs in Pakistan. Wake up before its too late and stop equating yourself with India - its gone far beyond Pakistan.

Rocky Jun 26, 2013 09:47pm

I don't know why we Indians and Pakistanis, always look towards the western powers for approval. Is it because we are so insecure a d unsure of ourselves? It is high time that we unite in trade and cultural relations and take our destiny in our own hands.

Muhammad Ahmed Mufti Jun 26, 2013 09:56pm

Beggars are not choosers. Next time choose PTI

Abdussamad Jun 26, 2013 10:19pm

The Pakistani govt. did do some damage control of its own. They planted a story in the local media that Kerry's visit was delayed because he was too busy stirring things up in the middle east vis a vis the Syrian crisis:

Now it looks like the visit is cancelled in its entirety.

Kanwal Jun 26, 2013 10:17pm

Which snub. They used to come here without invitations and impose their policies on us. The new government has stopped that blackmail. As expected he went to India in rush. And it's what it is.

syed baqar ahsan Jun 26, 2013 10:44pm

After so much of repeated snubs and insults from Americans since 9/11 or even before still people in our FO and Islamabad are up set then there is very seriously wrong with our mental state,Have some self respect and show some maturity.Just wait and ignore Americans rather snub them they will come back.Kerry seen bending/bowing in India,Indians are hard nut to crack,USA will do lot many compromises in India and get just that which suits India not USA.It is high time People in our FO please learn some diplomacy from Indian.Americans are arrogant and no more a role modal to fellow.

I.Butt Jun 26, 2013 10:52pm

The government of Pakistan should keep one policy agenda against US no matter which political party rule over the country. The national policy against the United States should be based on our best national interest, very much balanced and careful path for Pakistan to deal with US particularly where one could not see any contradiction in regard of Pakistan's national interest. unfortunately our politicians never stands firm against US in the course of our national interests that's why they always be ignored and embarrassed internationally. May God bless Pakistan !

HONEST BELIEF Jun 26, 2013 10:56pm

It is amazing that our Prime Minister is awaiting the visit from US Secretary of State. Americans are not fools, they know that given a chance, Nawaz Sharif will definitely ask the USA for more money. Another amazing fact is that the USA depends on India to teach the Afghans their democratic process. Doesn't the USA know how corrupt the Indian system is and that 60% of all ellected members in the Indian parliment have had a criminal record or still have some cases pending against them? Americans forget that this is Asia.

zuhaib Jun 26, 2013 10:56pm

stop the NATO supply routes or put a heavy tax on it and they will come running

Mustafa Jun 26, 2013 11:45pm

Pakistan is gradually isolating itself from rest of the world and the root cause is incompetence of its leaders who have first priority to crucify former president General Musharraf and keep distance from West to appease Talibans. The enemies of Pakistan are more than happy seeing the gradual isolation of Pakistan from the rest of the world.

Raja Jun 27, 2013 12:03am

That means Pakistan serves no purpose to the west.

Ali Jun 27, 2013 01:24am

Let the Indians play a bigger role. Afghanistan is known to drag every one down at least if does not break them.

Moazza Jun 27, 2013 01:28am if we care. We have our own internal challenges that are bigger than anything else right now. India, Pakistan comparison is not too important anymore. Its all about can we improve our own country!

Kashif Jun 27, 2013 02:27am

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, it must be a ...

Sabih Jun 27, 2013 02:37am

Thanks God for little mercies, it is about time that we should thank God and try to stand on our own feet. He is not visiting Pakistan is a great favor to us rather than a draw back, cause everyone know why !!!!!!!!

kirther Jun 27, 2013 02:59am

Don't worry about John Kerry visit because even if they all come and pour billion of dollars but still Pakistani politicians will continue the systematic destruction of Pakistan.

Moahammad Saleem Jun 27, 2013 02:59am

It's unfair and unrealistic to expect the Americans to treat Pakistan like they do India, as Pakistan has launched a proxy warfare of attrition against the US-led NATO forces in Afghanistan. Pakistan has become isolated and has brought bad name to itself for being an epicenter of terrorism and religious militancy.

farrukh butt Jun 27, 2013 03:12am

we should simply not forget whats being done to us and have the heart to stand up to anyone who has done so in the past.Not much is lost as the day for American forces pull out is coming near and no one will be there to protect INDIAN interests then.........all their CONSULATES will be at the mercy of TALIBAN..........we just have to sit back and enjoy the show when it starts.

Javed Jun 27, 2013 03:22am

Its better that he not come here in a rush. Let him go to these other countries. The relationship between Pakistan and the US requires a serious sit down and not one in haste. Kerry is more than welcome to come at a later time.

asif Jun 27, 2013 03:40am

who gives a hoot if Kerry did not go to Pakistan. The Pakistani politicians should focus on what they can do for the country, not who is visiting the country or not.

Nasir Jun 27, 2013 03:49am

Shouldn't be surprising given what all the past governments have done. as the saying goes "You get what you are looking for"

Arun Jun 27, 2013 03:53am

The Pakistan Foreign office has always seen itself competing with India on Afghanistan. If it did not, the poor Afghan people might actually see some stability and progress. Lets hope Sharif's government is more mature. After all, if Afghanistan goes back to chaos, it will hurt Pakistan much more than it will hurt India - the heat from a boiling Afghan nation will be felt first in Pakistan and could completely destabilize Pakistan.

Ironic that a Hindu majority nation is doing more constructive things in Muslim Afghanistan than Muslim Pakistan.

Pakistani Jun 27, 2013 03:54am

He wants to talk to someone sensible & responsible

VINOD Jun 27, 2013 05:53am

Please note that there is some thing cooking between the USA, PAKISTAN ARMY and TALIBAN, As such the Americans do not want to face the CIVIL GOVT OF PAKISTAN at this juncture.

muhammad faridoon Jun 27, 2013 06:51am

that is the greatest news to my ears in 10 years we the people of pakistan dont want or need to do anything with afghanistan,now we need to worry about how to get all the afghans out of our pakistan. i hope america dont bring us into this mess again.

shankar Jun 27, 2013 07:08am

If Pakistan's worry is that Mr. Kerry's visit to India is to give it a greater role in Afghanistan, why can't Pakistan and India honestly discuss this with each other. Afghanistan is a close neighbour of both countries and both countries are well-wishers of Afghanistan! Pakistan has its huge sphere of influence on Taliban and India may has some influence with the anti-Taliban factions. If both countries work together, it will be to the advantage of both countries and will benefit Afghanistan immensely. We should not be adding to the miseries of the war-ravaged Afghanistan by bringing in our petty regional mistrust into play. Why can't both countries resolve that they will not let Afghanistan descend into chaos again. And, when are we going to grow up and prevent others from manipulating us to their advantage?

Akil Akhtar Jun 27, 2013 07:07am

It is obvious that we do all the dirty work for USA and they give all the respect/support to our enemies. Theya re also strengthening them in Afghanistan agaisnt our interests. For how long are we going to be fooled by them. The pennies they throw our way are also ruining us.

A.A.Noorani Jun 27, 2013 07:14am

"This was unexpected for Pakistan

Hina Jun 27, 2013 08:12am

After so many years of experience Pak still live in illusion. USA and Israel and other are not interested in Pak but want to get the job done. In case one do not fall they are bombed.

Syed Ali Jun 27, 2013 08:39am

No one should blame, Kerry, or U.S. administration, for their treatment of Pakistan! Our corrupt politicians have shown this time and time again that no matter how shamelessly Pakistan is treated; the U.S. is always confident that Pakistani leadership will always be willing to lick their boots...whenever the U.S. orders them to do; so it doesn't make a difference to them! Will Pakistan ever have honorable and honest government and bureaucracy? We can only hope for it.

bubba Jun 27, 2013 08:55am

Rubbish. Despite numerous Pakistan articles indicating Kerry was coming to Pakistan it was never included on Kerry's travel itinerary which is available to anyone who has access to the internet. That's a pretty good sign that the trip was never formally planned and may have been wishful thinking by Pakistan. Further - indicating that the State Dept was in "overdrive damage control" is nonsense - cant' even find it mentioned in an American newspaper.

Narendra Jyala Jun 27, 2013 09:10am

"There is a view in Islamabad that Americans will come back to Pakistan for help when the Afghan situation gets to a crucial stage".

Rise up dear! Nobody is as important as a task. Please, do not be under the impression that without you (along with Taliban) nothing can be achieved. There are some way or the other to achieve the goal for peace and with course of the time today's important player becomes irrelevant tomorrow ( For example LTTE). So use the opportunity as and when it comes to you in a dynamic way for your benefit. Good Luck.

Caz Jun 27, 2013 09:35am

Pakistan is created on an intellectually dishonest idea. Its ego driven venal military led elites must accept their reality - pakistan is politically, economically and morally bankrupt and cannot be in the same league as India.

Bilal Jun 27, 2013 10:09am

I don't think this story deserves space on the front page even if it is correct. I mean seriously, whats the big deal???

Komal S Jun 27, 2013 10:28am

The following para is interesting "However, the real concern in Islamabad is that India may get the opportunity to train the Afghan security forces. In the past two years, Pakistani security officials have told Americans in talks that Pakistan does not want an unstable force on its border, which can turn to drug smuggling and internal strife when the Americans leave".

So Afganistan should not have trained security force to protect itself, because pakistan is concerned that they will be used for drug smuggling. I am pretty sure Pakistan has Afganistan best interests when it makes statements like these.

Komal S Jun 27, 2013 10:27am

Statements like these expose Pakistan more "However, the real concern in Islamabad is that India may get the opportunity to train the Afghan security forces.In the past two years, Pakistani security officials have told Americans in talks that Pakistan does not want an unstable force on its border, which can turn to drug smuggling and internal strife when the Americans leave" Afganistan as a soverign country has every right to have a security force whether pakistan likes it or not.

aslam minhas Jun 27, 2013 10:31am

The foreign office would devise a plan to get Kerry (if he ever comes) received by a low minion from the ministry and not be granted an interview by the PM. That would set them thinking. Can we show a bit of self respect!

zia khan Jun 27, 2013 10:53am

I don't understand why our leaders have to be on their knees all the time. People of Pakistan want leaders to deal with Americans or any other nation with honor and dignity. It is always American coming with a list of demands. We should also put before them our demands and concerns. I have never seen our foreign minister going to America with a list of demands and concerns. Why we have left it to American to decide when to meet, what to talk and whom to meet.

Realist Jun 27, 2013 11:06am

Once a slave, always a slave. We destroyed the first friendly Afghan government at USA's behest in 2002. Today we are not even invited for talks involving the region's stability. Mere words are not enough to express the depth of emotion.

Dr Vimal Raina Jun 27, 2013 11:19am

No, Kerry did not snub Pakistan. Unfortunately Pakistan has nothing to offer except a security dialogue. There is nothing else to discuss except Taliban and Afghanistan. A lot of talk has already happened on these matters and you have to take a notch up or down, So it depends on the parameters that decide just that. With India it needs trade and beyond that. By that it means not just China but Iran and ASEAN and many more things. Yes Afghanistan too. However strong reservations anyone might have about India, I am pretty sure that Kerry would like Afghanistan to have India-like institutions rather than any other country in Afghanistan's neighbourhood, least of all Pakistan. In that process whatever India might rub into Afghanistan can be collateral damage for Pakistan. But you will have to live with it. It is a lesser evil than India not being involved in Afghanistan. Yes Kerry will come at a later date when the discussions will be hot headed and more about post withdrawl scenario.

Azm Jun 27, 2013 12:17pm

When will we stop deluding ourselves? Its clear they do not think of us as their allies. They use us when they need us and turn a blind eye when we have done their dirty work for them.

sri1 Jun 27, 2013 12:17pm

Food for thought. Now that that Taliban is directly talking to the USA, the latter is interested in talking to the grown-ups instead of the kid with multiple-personality syndrome and a lot of ailments that it first needs to remedy to grow healthy and independent.

46664 Jun 27, 2013 12:15pm

There is no need to guess. It was a snub.

Zain Jun 27, 2013 12:29pm

Americans are known to opportunist regardless on who they step on. Pakistan should have learned the lesson after 1980 Afghan war. Pakistan should divert its attention to regional powers Russia and China.

Masoud Jun 27, 2013 12:51pm

I think With all the years of experience befriending US, Pakistani leaders should have by now learnt to know well the attitude of the US towards. This is not the first time such things have happened. Pakistan should learn to live on its own.

Abdullah Jun 27, 2013 12:55pm

@Pakistani: like he is

Pakistani Jun 27, 2013 01:38pm

Most people in this country probably think it but dont say it loud. So, I'll say it for them:


Mustafa Jun 27, 2013 01:59pm

Both he and his Indian allies are the loosing side on the battle field, he is in no position to snub anyone. Baniya brigade can make all sorts of asinine comments on this site, but they cannot hide the fact that for the second time in less than a generation, they have bet on the wrong horse in Afghanistan. Talk is cheap, facing Taliban takes real blood, only Pakistan army can do it if we are not saddled with our corrupt politicians and American "friends". Baniya brigade should come out of denial and accept that they, their uncle Sam and fat aunt Europa have lost to 30000 bare-foot illiterates. Baniya brigade should also stop living a lie and snap out of their Superpower syndrome.

Mustafa Jun 27, 2013 02:09pm


"When will we stop deluding ourselves? Its clear they do not think of us as their allies."

i don't know any Pakistani who has any delusion about the Americans being our allies. The delusion we suffer from is that our politicians who are not even "demo" will bring "democracy", they are demons who can only bring us demoncracy.

Adnan Bukhari Jun 27, 2013 02:30pm

Unequivocally, Pakistan has a greater role to play in Afghan peace process. We vigorously support the idea of "Afghan-led and Afghan-owned" process for conflict resolution but in the way Pakistan is marginalized and India is rose to central role in Afghanistan by the US is the failure of Pakistan's diplomatic efforts.

fida sayani Jun 27, 2013 02:39pm

You shame me once, shame on you. You shame me twice, shame on me. Pakistani politician, civil and army hauncho

bjp Jun 27, 2013 02:44pm

Us will want to start a new clash between pakistan and india on afghan issue so that us can benefit and pave the way for withdrawl. In the recent past Us did this in iraq by engaging shias and sunni sects.

Zeel Jun 27, 2013 02:44pm

@Ali: But has the spirit done anything good for Afghanistan ? It is easy to say that Afghans have fought off all invaders in the past - but what did they do to themselves after the Russians withdrew ? The ensuing civil war and Taliban rule must not have been better than foreign occupation ?

FB Jun 27, 2013 03:34pm

Soon India will be kicked out once it is done since U.S. had no history of loyality.

syed baqar ahsan Jun 27, 2013 03:52pm

Since he has taken over Secretary of State he has been briefed about the official stance towards Pakistan,now he knows the real story of American's doubling gaming with Pakistan,now he has no guts to dictate or snub.I don't when our media will give benefit of doubt to us.

well wisher Jun 27, 2013 04:00pm

@Md Imran: WOW any one know from which planet Mr. Md. Imran have come from. Indeed Afghans will never forget all the magnanimity and love with which Pakistanis have created havoc in Afghanistan by arming and training militants and Taliban. Which in turn have destroyed the social fabric of the country and pushing three generation of afghans into virtual stone age. Most surprising aspect is still Pakistanis are not satisfied with what they have done to once beautiful country......Wake up n stop look what is happening in your back yard. ...all that you have done to Afghanistan will haunt Pakistanis for ages to come.

syed baqar ahsan Jun 27, 2013 04:17pm

I don't know when our American or western centric mind set will change of our everything and now Arabistion is an other dilemma ruining social and national fibre of this country.Do we have any one of like this of our own i e foreign policy,pride,honour,dignity,morales,nationalism spirit,unity or discipline.By following others we lost our every thing .

syed baqar ahsan Jun 27, 2013 04:30pm

@46664: He knew it he would be told eye-to-eye the double gaming of Americans with Pakistan.He had no guts to face,now they have India to bluff and bully.Nine died bodies of their soldiers given to Indian before arrival of PM to occupied Kashmir.This is how Americans talk to their friends before or after the visit.

syed baqar ahsan Jun 27, 2013 04:39pm

@JP Singh: what all is happening with Americans today will happen with the Indians later therefore better lay off .

syed baqar ahsan Jun 27, 2013 04:44pm

@Ahmad: I wish everybody think like you but we lack seriously

FACT Jun 27, 2013 04:44pm

@Pakistani: Than he can land in KPK to meet Pervaiz Khatak. Did I make you happy????

MR Jun 27, 2013 04:44pm

@sri1: Except that they don't know the 'grown up' is just a grown-up form of the kid, trying to claim land when the white man leaves...just like he did 66 years back.

mudassar khokhar Jun 27, 2013 04:57pm

who cares if Americans discuss this with us or not. They are not welcomed in any shape or form.

Mian Mithu Jun 27, 2013 05:29pm

@Arun: India can follow the footsteps of the Soviet Union and the USA if they - though I doubt if it will be appealing in the long run. The Soviet Union poured millions in support for the communists in 70's and in the end they had to send troops, which brought their system to a collapse. The USA supported the Mujahideen with billions before they had to send in the troops and pour billions in aid to secure Karzai and buy the passivity of the war lords. The billions will dry up as they leave. India is welcome to fill the void left when the US leaves. However, I doubt if India can foot the bill and India is after all the country with the largest number of people below the poverty line. Most importantly India have the same relationship with Afghanistan as Pakistan - it's much more distant relationship. Pakistan you must remember is the country with the largest Pushtun population in the world and with a very long and porous border. Anyway keep up the good work. The honeymoon may be short lived.

Mian Mithu Jun 27, 2013 05:45pm

@sri1: I think at the moment a hysterical and difficult Hamid Karzai is a bigger headache for America. Everyone admits that Pakistan, together with the Qataris and the Europeans were instrumental in bringing the Taliban to the table. The Taliban could have talked to the Americans earlier if they wanted to go independently. If you look at the way things have developed it is clearly the process that Pakistan urged about 6 or 7 years ago. Then the world thought it was a matter of time and Karzai could be imposed on Afghanisatan - now they are all anxious to talk. The world is now following Pakistan's recommendations and that is why Kerry had to go to India to put them at ease. India cannot afford to handle Afghanistan alone. Too many wretchedly poor Indians will be angered by any attempt to divert funds from India to Afghanistan. India is after all the nation in the world with the largest number of people below the poverty line.

Naeem Syed Jun 27, 2013 05:57pm

Prime Minister has said in no uncertain words to the US diplomatic Staff in Islamabad that his Government does not any more Drone attacks, Kerry has been a good friend of Pakistan's in the past, projecting Pakistan's problem to the US Govt in the past so why the snub, and that in India too. Mr Prime Minister the elections are over and the election Rhetoric needs to be shelved and the dialogue based on reality is the need of the day. Don't be like Misbah " We will win the series" and comes away having lost everything. Suck it up, face reality and get on with solving the problems with helping hand from the US. they have the money and the expertise to help with, the Economy, the Military,the Chronic Power Shortage, Development of Balochistan's mineral wealth,Oil and Gas, and then the biggest Problem that Pakistan faces today" Musharraf". If you remember he is a pal of Senator Kerry.

Ayaz Jun 27, 2013 06:08pm

@ashraf a jamal: 15 million Afghan refugees? Where you got these numbers?

MSA Jun 27, 2013 06:09pm

Kerry's cancellation of his visit to Pakistan is a clear indication to Pakistani's where their government stands in the world. Pakistan enjoyed best world respect in the days of Musharraf. Now that the Pakistan government is jailing Musharraf, the world understands what these people are.

My dear fellows, wait and see where you are getting, under the present government.

ailly Jun 27, 2013 06:11pm

wow, turning their back on Pakistan ?. I don't think so, this is the case. My guess is USA intend to involve our Army in this dialogue rather than our politicians who keep on changing parties and policies, so they carry no credibility neither they have clear cut policies. Out politicians are like their high school pupils who wait for the teacher for next lecture. So let it be, pupils will wait for their next dictation or lecture whatever pleases you.

tee jay Jun 27, 2013 06:21pm

Why do have complex of Americans. It does not matter at this moment that if Kerry is visiting Pakistan or otherwise. They need us at this moment and we need to negotiate our terms in the best interest of Pakistan. Please hold your nerves and be strong. Do not get into these petty gestures as this is psychological tactics which they have been playing with Pakistan since our country was established. The India card is always used by Americans to get a better deal from Pakistan. So do not get scarred and negotiate on the best terms. Americans will oblige. I bet on this.

James Jun 27, 2013 06:54pm

I think India and Pakistan should work together to bring about a stable sustainable democratic government in Afganistan. I hope the Pakistanis have figured out by now, that Afganistan is not a "zero-sum game", where if they win, then India loses and vice versa. Taliban is poison, and all it takes is one drop of poison to make the well unusable for the whole village. Let's work together to promote progressive forces in Afganistan and not undermine that country. India gains neither strategic depth nor economic benefits from a deep engagement in Afganistan - but they will have better peace of mind knowing that their civilian airplanes will not be high-jacked and taken to kandahar under the protection of the Taliban...only if Pakistan would help out and not become victim of historical resentments and cliched positions.

Javs323 Jun 27, 2013 07:29pm

I totally agree. Pakistan should kick out all those people of Afghani origin back into Afghanistan who have resorted to criminal and illegal activities within Pakistan. They have been eating the country from inside like a cancer. Historically, Afghanis have always sided with India. Being Muslims has no meaning to them. Let them get in bed with the Indians and be allowed to roam the streets of Indian cities. This alone will become the most powerful defense against India for the Pakistanis. They can put their nuclear arsenal away in cold storage and focus on rebuilding their country.

afghan Jun 27, 2013 09:15pm

india and pakistan will never grow up to their responsibilty because they have some one to take care of them The colonalist power made them asleep to their illusional state . India exists at the expense of free china and Paki exist at the expense of free afghan as soon as that hope waned for the west you will soon realize your status que.

Asif Jun 27, 2013 09:20pm

This fellow is a bungling every time he makes a move. Invited PM Singh got snubbed, talked about the pipeline through Pakistan to India again India snubbed, Demonstrated his inept understanding of foreign affairs by telling Indian journalist that he will not renew Kayani's extension. Rather than opening diplomatic channel the buffoon talks openly his opposition to drones - do you really think America will get down its knees and give-up its prized weapon system that limits terrorists to their houses? Great Diplomatic skill Mr.PM!!

Indian Jun 27, 2013 09:45pm

@Md Imran: Pure Day dreaming!! Be realistic and talk sense.

Abdul Jun 27, 2013 10:35pm

@zia khan: Your leaders are on their knees to beg, beg for money.

Pankaj Jun 28, 2013 12:27am

@Zain: You mean Russia and China are saints.........Try to stand up on your feet.......If you can't better surrender yourself to your country of origin, without any pre-conditions..........You would be in better situation.

Pankaj Jun 28, 2013 12:37am

@Akil Akhtar: What else can Pakistan do ? What are the options left for Pakistan ?

Pankaj Jun 28, 2013 12:48am

@Ali: Nice and realistic thoughts............ BTW, India is not interested in ruling Afgans like others... India is interested in teaching the path of prosperity to Afgans. Pakistan can also join India to learn about peace and prosperity.

Prado Jun 28, 2013 01:48am

Indians are funny,

there are a nation has poor record of democracy (look how they treated kashmirs when they demanded thier rights) and has 700M poor people and they will develop Afganistan?... from what where stone to the bronze age?

Aimal Jun 28, 2013 01:47am

@farrukh butt: Sit back ? : Isn't Taliban already making your seat red hot?

Max Jun 28, 2013 02:30am

Its time that Pakistan stand on its legs and stop looking at US , Now Pakistan should snub US for few years they will try to cry as next year they need Pakistan and let them beg and pay upfront . The only reason to tech uncle Sam a good lesson .

Nofil Shah Jun 28, 2013 02:48am

Two things I would like to share right here, right now. The US foreign policy is never cause or issue justified, and secondly we are not in any position to demand of Uncle Sam that they ought to start treating us like grown ups. Why? Just go through Pakistan's tethered history, promises made by the capitalist leader of the free world were never fulfilled. And last but not the least, despite our ability to bullshit global financial white elephants, we do not do our job. Which is paying the price of freedom, to vote and to do things which take time to be detected.

Vince Jun 28, 2013 02:55am

If your rulers had any pride they would end diplomatic relationship with this enemy of Pakistan.

John Jun 28, 2013 03:55am

@Nizamuddin Ahmad: "Driven by hunger, a fox tried to reach some grapes hanging high on the vine but was unable to, although he leaped with all his strength. As he went away, the fox remarked, 'Oh, you aren't even ripe yet! I don't need any sour grapes."

Fawad Jun 28, 2013 05:30am

@Naeem Syed: The biggest problem Pakistan faces is Terrorism buddy. Terrorism breaks countries. Your priorities are a bit mixed up, rest I agree with u.

Ghareeb Adami Jun 28, 2013 05:57am

Your real enemies are your politicians who believe that their foreign business and dollar accounts are guarantee to their survival. And dollars come from uncle SAM.

Ghareeb Adami Jun 28, 2013 06:02am


Ghareeb Adami Jun 28, 2013 06:04am


aditya Jun 28, 2013 06:33am

@syed baqar ahsan: Sure weems to have happened ALL the Time and MANY times with pakistan over SIXTY years hasent it???Hmnnnnn

aditya Jun 28, 2013 06:30am

@syed baqar ahsan: Doubling game?? guys INVENTED

mike jackson Jun 28, 2013 08:27am

The reason Kerry snubbed the Pakistanis is that they don't like the present government. The existing setup comprises of the least trustworthy , dishonest ,fascist and crooked of the Pakistanis. It was a natural reaction from the state department. They like to work with classy people.The various comments here are a living proof of the cranially challenged , short sighted and fascist psyche of your present readership.

khalid sheikh Jun 28, 2013 08:35am

@Mustafa: shahbash mustafa

syed baqar ahsan Jun 28, 2013 08:37am

OH! For God sake remove this news item,how can they snub rather he can not face,now being American official he knows and briefed their own double gaming towards Pakistan,now sending their points man PM of UK to give lollypops or spoil the visit of our PM to CHINA.Better bring positive change in your attitude,stop dictating and arm twisting.

syed baqar ahsan Jun 28, 2013 08:45am

@Naeem Syed: come on ! you don't know the double gaming of Americans,they give lollies,organize separatist movements,blasts,TTP is their funded.

gp65 Jun 28, 2013 08:57am

@zuhaib:"stop the NATO supply routes or put a heavy tax on it and they will come running"

Poor short term memory it seems. You had done exactly that for 7 months and o one came running.

gp65 Jun 28, 2013 09:13am

@Md Imran: :*** Pakistan has always been the leader of ummah and remain so. There is no need to involve UAE or Qatar when it comes to negotiating any sort of agreement in a muslim country".**

Leader of Muslim ummah? Is that why 180 million Indian Muslims stayed back in India instead of moving to Pakistan? Is that why Bangladesh dissociated itself with PAkistan? What role have you played in the Iran Iraq crisis? when Iraq invaded Kuwait? Recently during crisis in Libya and then Syria? Delusions of grandeur have made Pakistan punch above its weight class which has in the end hurt Pakistan itself more than anyone else.

"US should also allow Pakistan to dictate its own destiny when it comes to Kashmir without any interventions. The core issue has been India's stubborness when it comes to handing over Kashmir. Once that issue is resolved, the region can expect peace and prosperity".

US has no leverage over India and cannot dictate India's Kashmir policy. President elect Obama did think along the lines you indicated in 2008 but after assuming office he found out soon enough and had to re-designate Hallbrooke's title from Kashmir envoy to Af-Pak envoy.

Budh Jumirat Jun 28, 2013 10:06am

@Mian Mithu: Rightly said Mian Mithu.. I second you

Truth Jun 28, 2013 10:50am

@Md Imran: WOW any one know from which planet Mr. Md. Imran have come from. Indeed Afghans will never forget all the magnanimity and love with which Pakistanis have created havoc in Afghanistan by arming and training militants and Taliban. Which in turn have destroyed the social fabric of the country and pushing three generation of afghans into virtual stone age. Most surprising aspect is still Pakistanis are not satisfied with what they have done to once beautiful country......Wake up n stop look what is happening in your back yard. ...all that you have done to Afghanistan will haunt Pakistanis for ages to come.

Bharat Jun 28, 2013 12:03pm

What exactly will he do in Worlds no 1 failed state ?

If he goes to Pakistan,Pakistan will start begging for funds or for alms

Burjor Jun 28, 2013 12:18pm

Pakistan should concentrate and put its house in order, as, when and if that every happens Pakistan will not need outside help. As long as Pakistan remains a beggar nation, an unstable nation, an unsecure nation, an impoverished nation, an illitrate nation, an unemployed nation, a nation of warped minds, we will repeat the mistakes of the previous 65 years.

shuaib Jun 28, 2013 12:48pm

@Pakistani: Not exactly, he wants to fool someone else!!!

Hameed A Sheikh Jun 28, 2013 02:09pm

Who cares if this clown of USA visits Pakistan or not.I think Pakistan should show the doors closed for any USA attempt to get any assistance in getting out of Afghanistan.They should go to India for such help.Also Pakistan should close the smuggling corridor for Afghan Trade and transit.In few months both USA and Afghanistan shall understand that nothing is free in this world and nothing should be taken for granted.But it requires a bold decision from Paksitan Govt. and we doubt it has this much courage.

Oh God Jun 28, 2013 03:36pm

@Caz: Friend, it has been 67 years. Whatever idea it was founded on, grow up and let it go. You and hordes of other Indians must stop obsessing about why and how and by who Pakistan was made.

mian pattha Jun 28, 2013 05:15pm

@farrukh butt: hmmm thats why taliban is doing target practice on pakistanis ? eh ?

AntiTerror Jun 28, 2013 07:35pm

@zia khan: Beggars cannot be choosers !

raja hindustani Jun 29, 2013 12:41am

@Prado: Bronze age is still better than ''stone age'' where your country leading......... ;)

Riaz Jun 29, 2013 01:54am

What do expect fron US. That is what we get by being there lackeys. We should know who are friends and make sure we do nothing to risk that. The friend in question is China.

Ajay Vikram Singh Jun 29, 2013 03:33am

That's the tragedy. Instead of being concerned more why pakistan is not given opportunity to train afghans in electoral exercise, they are rather worried about, why pakistan is not given opportunity to train afghan security forces. It shows the security state mentality and its highly regressive. When we stop thinking in terms of imaginary security issue and focus more on development, poverty, health, democracy and justice all doors to prosperity, lasting peace and happiness will open for ordinary Pakistani. Every successive govt in pakistan will be better than before and slowly and gradually whole society starts getting better in every aspect. That in turn will give strength to pakistan in world stage and its voice will be heard and respected. That will take away most of security issues in long run. Instead of thinking from this narrow security mindset, think strategic and long term pakistan. There is no threat from india. There is nothing we want from pakistan except stability and peace. Pakistan must stop thinking about external issues for next few decades. A democratic and stable afghanistan wont be under control of anyone, including india as this article mentions that america can not dictate india. if our whole region is governed under aspirations of common people within a democratic setup, all our problems will go away. all external intervention will go away. all security issues will go away.

Ajay Vikram Singh Jun 29, 2013 04:03am

There are people who want peace, freedom, stability, prosperity, growth, good governance, economic opportunities, education and there are people who want chaos, violence, corruption, ignorance, power. These two kinds of people are there across the region, across pakistan, afghanistan and india. Join the right side folks. stop thinking in terms of indians, pakistanis, afghans. think in terms of progressive and regressive people. People who want change and people who want to maintain status-quo. Why are you folks so obsessed about india and security issues? When you are a stable, progressive, aware, educated society, you are strong in a real sense. Our region hosts the largest number of poor & oppressed people in the world. Hunger, water, terrorism, corruption, religious fanaticism, climate change, energy, economy, education - these are the real issues. Pakistan must STOP thinking about global issues, imaginary security threats etc. your universities, hospitals, offices, courts, markets are your real source of strength not amount of arms or number of army-men. why are you worried about afghans or syria or india or arabia. worry about your own people. worry about pakistan. when you provide justice, stability, opportunities, water, electricity to your own people, you are worth listening to. when you have young, educated, bright work force you are worth looking at. when you produce scientists, scholars, industrialists, social workers you are worth talking about. If you want respect from the world, respect your own people first. what the hell is wrong with you people?

Sanjay Jun 29, 2013 07:52am

@Oh God: Indians are more than happy that partition happened and thank Jinnah for it, otherwise what is happening in Pakistan today would be happening all over India.

gary Jun 29, 2013 12:49pm

@aslam minhas:

Do you have any self respect? We doubt it.

You can stop taking all aid from USA to start with.

gary Jun 29, 2013 12:53pm

@farrukh butt: This only confirms Taliban and Pakistan army are hand in gloves. No wonder the world calls Pakistan as epicentre of terrorism.

gary Jun 29, 2013 12:59pm

@Ahmad: There will never be any gas from Iran as the Americans do not want that.

gary Jun 29, 2013 01:03pm

@Md Imran:

Pakistan has always been the leader of ummah and remain so.............. since when.may I ask?

A nation which cannot make its budget without foreign aid,calls himself leader. Shame.

Quranic Thinker Jun 29, 2013 02:56pm

@Zain: Pakistan should remember the saying: It is far better and respectful to be wife of a decently rich, hard working man rather than concubine of many rich men. The biggest folly Pakistan did was to leave his own husbands house in 1947, for greener pastures. The rich masters changed her name and converted her from Indian to Islam and used her as per their choice (gave some pennies in return but no respect). This is the time to do all rethinking and explore the options to return back to her original home, if possible.

Hemchandra Vikramaditya Jun 29, 2013 05:18pm

@aditya: For this once I have to talk in support of Pakistan...

Pakistan never invented anything ok!! They only have one book Quran to follow and few more Hadiths...They have no need for invention ok!! If you say Double game is mentioned in Quran....Where in it's beginning parts when Mohammad (PBUH) is in weak position in Mecca he preached peace and religious intolerance and in later part of book where Muslims became strong in Medina he preached to terrorise non-believers!! Then perhaps we may consider Pakistan is following same strategy but please don't offend our Pakistani brothers with saying words like "invention,etc" which are totally un-islamic...!!! {Curious point to note is it is Islam that preached scientific invention culture and planted seeds of modern science in West...but forgot everything about it}

zia khan Jun 29, 2013 05:37pm

@Mian Mithu: Shabash Mian Mithu

p r sharma Jun 29, 2013 05:38pm

@Hameed A Sheikh: Ignorance is a bliss too. Enjoy.