ISLAMABAD: The Council of Islamic Ideology (CII) has declared that DNA test is not acceptable as primary evidence in cases of rape, but it could be used as a supporting evidence for confirmation of the crime.

A meeting of the CII, presided over by its chairman Maulana Mohammad Khan Sherani on Wednesday, also maintained that there was nothing wrong with the blasphemy law and it didn’t need amendment.

The meeting was of the view that Islam has set procedures to determine cases of rape and said Islamic procedure should be adopted during investigation.

It declared human cloning illegal because it is against Islam.

The CII directed the Higher Education Commission and other institutions to correct English translation of ‘Allah’, ‘Rasool’ and ‘Masjid’.

It said the usage of ‘Holy Book’ and ‘Holy Place’ was illegal.

The meeting expressed concern over changes made in the syllabus of Islamic Studies, especially in Punjab, and instructed the provincial government to include the deleted chapters/essays from the curriculum.

It instructed the Director General, Research, Mohammad Ilyas Khan who is also CII secretary, to send letters to all provinces and Gilgit-Baltistan asking them to ensure Islamic education in their syllabus.

The meeting ordered the authorities to look into the books being taught in educational institutions and rectify errors.

The council suggested dialogue to resolve the issue of ‘Ruet-i-Hilal’ (sighting of moon) due to which every year a dispute arises between religious scholars of Khyber Pakhtunkhawa and other provinces.

Maulana Mufti Ghulam Mustafa Rizvi, retired Justice Nazir Akhtar, retired Justice Mushtaq Ahmed, Dr Mohammad Idrees Soomro, Allama Iftikhar Hussain Naqvi, Saeed Ahmed Shah Gujrati, Maulana Hanif Jalandhari and others attended the meeting.

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Comments (164)

May 30, 2013 3:04 am
Who is more authoritative in Pakistan: The Council of Islamic Ideology or the Supreme Court of Pakistan? With people like CII, you don't need enemies.
May 30, 2013 3:06 am
Director General of Science and Research of Pakistan is the secretary of The Council of Islamic Ideology. Who will save Pakistan?
H mirza
May 30, 2013 5:35 am
And the sun revolves around the earth, I guess........
May 30, 2013 5:58 am
Who died and made them president. So we will need three eye witnesses to convict a rapist because DNA evidence is not good enough! Plus does anyone think the topics under discussion by this body are really relevant!
May 30, 2013 6:23 am
CII will keep us tied in centuries old customs in the name of religion, if they could. The good news is they can't ...
May 30, 2013 6:31 am
Why dont we get into a time machine and go back to the dark ages as well. Maybe its time we joined the rest of the world and incorporate modern thinking and mordern practices.
May 30, 2013 6:33 am
I don't like the decision of CII. Its thinking appears to be regressive and I mean no offense to the leadership of this body.
May 30, 2013 6:46 am
Masha Allah, what a 'stretegic' level decisions are being made in the CII.
May 30, 2013 7:16 am
In this age, these Mullahs are still living in the 8th Century. Wake up guys, please wake up......
May 30, 2013 7:19 am
Only one word, PATHETIC
Left is Right
May 30, 2013 7:32 am
Since the use of DNA will be inadmissible in court, the victim will now have to reply on divine help to seek justice. It would have been easier if the CII had simply said that justice to rape victimes shall be delivered on the Day of Judgment !!!!
Mian Mithu
May 30, 2013 7:39 am
The journalist should kindly explain the difference between primary and secondary evidence to the reader.
May 30, 2013 7:46 am
thank you for never winning the elections
May 30, 2013 7:47 am
Let us dissove this useless council who still wants to live in dark ages.
May 30, 2013 7:47 am
Another suggestion - Change the name of "Pakistan". 1. because there is no "P" in Arabic and 2. There can be no "Pak" place on the earth other than the Arab Peninsula..
El Cid
May 30, 2013 7:49 am
An astute observation. And excellent decision. Such DNA can be 'stolen' and given to an accomplice and implanted as incriminating evidence else where, against someone, on some one. A number of such scenarios are possible and can be referenced. Collaborating evidence is an absolute for rape. I have studied the nature of forensic evidence. Am in the know of such examples and precedence. Those who deny this wise decision need to study the subject.
El Cid
May 30, 2013 8:02 am
Pathetic indeed. But you would not how much even if it stared back at you in the mirror.
Jehangir Masud
May 30, 2013 9:12 am
Perhaps it is time to introduce some minimal educational qualifications for members of this august body.
May 30, 2013 9:31 am
Is it a joke? Who is by the way this gentleman (I can not immagine a woman having such a responsible position in Pakistan)? And, the last question: waht are aims and objectives of this "Science and Research of Pakistan" ?
May 30, 2013 9:34 am
It can't be the prime proof to prove "rape" Other things around should also be looked into, if used blindly ignoring other evidence can be missuded for blackmailing.
Sayeed Altaf Hussein
May 30, 2013 9:41 am
El Cid, my friend you are in the view that a rape victim should provide four male witnesses. Excellent. A rapist is going to invite to you watch whilst he commits such a heinous crime. Because you're in the know how. Also can you explain how can the DNA be incriminated when the sobs are taken internally. Islam is a progressive religion and allows you to adapt new ways. As it says in the holy Quran, Go out and observe my creation and learn from it. These mulahs need to catch up with the times.
May 30, 2013 9:58 am
Another reason for people to get educated. What do these people know about DNA?. Should they be deciding what can be used as evidence when they have no idea what science can do for us in this field.
May 30, 2013 9:58 am
Can somebody ask them why DNA result can not be a primary evidence?? What will be the reaction of CII about the DNA test to establish the Paternity dispute and to prove a woman as adutrous? Will these mullahas still say DNA test is not a valid or enough evidence?
May 30, 2013 10:00 am
Perhpas it will be useful to illustrate when and in which country injustice has been done due to DNA evidence. I believe you need to study the subject a bit more. Give me the name of one developed country please, where DNA can not be used as evidence.
May 30, 2013 10:07 am
We should do what Ataturk did, and round up all these backward maulvis and shove them onto a ship and sail them away never to return. Look where Turkey is today, and look at where the rest of the Muslim world with Mullahs is.
May 30, 2013 10:12 am
No DNA? Ok, but what about internet or cars or medicines or electricity or ....
May 30, 2013 10:16 am
All the more reason to separate state from religion. We need to stop looking towards religion for definition in every walk of life.
El Cid
May 30, 2013 10:46 am
Where did I say that DNA cannot be used as evidence? Comprehension problems?
May 30, 2013 10:57 am
They should be taken to west, of course on official tour, to a training session on the said issue.. DNA test was not available 1000 years ago.. Islam does not discourage advancement in science and its use. These people need improved cloning (but they have declared it as a sin!)
El Cid
May 30, 2013 10:59 am
Where does the article say that “the use of DNA will not be admissible in court”? The article clearly states that DNA can not be used as primary evidence: “DNA test is not acceptable as primary evidence in cases of rape, but it could be used as a supporting evidence for confirmation of the crime.” Please read and comprehend before you comment.
May 30, 2013 11:48 am
They are guardians of religion. Please refrain from questioning their centuries old intelligence which is sill living in that era.
Expat (usa)
May 30, 2013 12:12 pm
Forgive them Oh' Almighty for they know not what they are discussing. For them ignorance is bliss.
May 30, 2013 12:27 pm
Only in Pakistan would ignorance against advances in Health and Technology be seen. People over all over the world have been proved innocent or guilty thru DNA testing. I think these Maulvi's forget that in the bright days of Islam we were the world leaders of the sciences.
May 30, 2013 12:33 pm
What does it even mean when they say "against Islam" or "illegal"? When they use words like this, is it not coming clear that these men are not men of faith, but of power?
Agha Ata (USA)
May 30, 2013 12:40 pm
DNA test, as an evidence, should be replaced by the opinion of a mullah (of the nearest mosque of the crime scene). I am sure that would be acceptable. :)
Syed Hussain Akbari
May 30, 2013 12:40 pm
Thus, Pakistan continues to run further backward. And poor woman further goes in distress. These Mullahs never win in any election but are always there to create problem just because of the illiteracy of general public. I do not have prayers for this association. CII tends to produce another reason that people start thinking to migrate.
May 30, 2013 12:40 pm
If your DNA sample, hair or flake of skin is thrown from the plastic bag on the rape victim, just to teach you a lesson then you will run towards ISLAM and be in sujood whole night to beg Allah to save you from this forge implication. Hence this cannot be the main evidence but supplement evidence… Hope this clarifies more.... :-)
May 30, 2013 12:42 pm
I am sorry it is not maulvies fault......we need to fix our education system.....and answer to many of those problemis simple more schools.....more schools......more schools.....
May 30, 2013 12:47 pm
simply answer this, when a rape happens, will the women arrange 4 witness before her rape so that she can file a case????
Bakhtawer BIlal
May 30, 2013 12:54 pm
Of course! dna cannot be proof enough. Only 4 men, who watched the complete episode, and then has the audacity to come forward and tell the Qazi that they saw it, is proof enough.
May 30, 2013 12:55 pm
ignorance is not the enemy of knowledge but illusion of knowledge is the real enemy of knowledge.
May 30, 2013 12:57 pm
Who on earth is CII. Why are these bodies allowed to grow up? Holy Book is illegal!?
Bakhtawer BIlal
May 30, 2013 1:03 pm
Strip this CII of all the modern day amenities and give them a tent for an office. Take away their cars and give them camels to ride.
May 30, 2013 1:19 pm
The only unfortunate thing in this message is that the CII comprises of retired "Justices" . Only God can save Pakistan
May 30, 2013 1:32 pm
Even in the United States it is cannot be used as the primary or only source of evidence. Look at the broader aspect. It was not dismissed as an evidence or supporting evidence, it's just that it cannot be used as the primary evidence to convict a person.
Arman Zain
May 30, 2013 1:38 pm
What makes so called developed countries to guide us or decide for us about our laws. I am a scientist and I can assure you DNA IS NOT ENOUGH TO PROVE RAPE. It can be a mutual consent and simple adultery but one can claim is rape if DNA is to be considered primary evidence.
May 30, 2013 1:38 pm
Well in that case you need to come up with a modern way and quicker way to resolve Rape cases... you are going to have quite a lot more..
El Cid
May 30, 2013 1:45 pm
False propaganda meme...but well spread.
El Cid
May 30, 2013 1:47 pm
May 30, 2013 1:54 pm
We as Muslims have the obligation to learn our religion and only THEN comment on it. To know what the primary evidence is, we should ask Ulama or Muftees and, for a change, do some research too. Dawn can also improve by telling the whole story.
El Cid
May 30, 2013 1:56 pm
No..! What is your basis for such an absurd belief? Please cite a primary reference in support of such a serious allegation?
El Cid
May 30, 2013 2:12 pm
HE just least in this area. This criteria protects innocents against false charges, blackmail, and manipulation of evidence.
May 30, 2013 2:13 pm
You are as feeble minded as the people in the CII. Rational intellects question their beliefs and discard them if they are irrational or founded in dogma....That is what civilized societies do...Pakistan and most Islamic countries are no longer civilized societies and have slid further into their dark ages.......
really upset
May 30, 2013 2:21 pm
I am sure you are joking El Cid.... these 4 men must be spineless or accomplices as no Muslim can watch injustice to happen in front and not do anything.... GOD is JUST. This law of 4 men is Man Made to protect the rapists
Salma Khan
May 30, 2013 2:25 pm
Very respectfully, Maulana Sherani, you lost me. DNA is also created by Allah (swt) and so are its myriads of remarkable uses in human-invented health and forensic applications. If it can be used as a primary determinant of paternity testing, why should rape cases be an exception; it must be available as an investigative tool in parallel with other methods. Denying latest technology a rightful place in Islam is akin to slighting the blessings of Allah (swt).
May 30, 2013 2:31 pm
"IQRA" was meant for the believers of Quran but CII is trying to change it to "LAA IQRA". Pakistan needs to have better educated scholars with some exposure to science as members of CII.
May 30, 2013 2:37 pm
If the new govt is serious about getting cost under control then eliminating the The Council of Islamic Ideology should be an easy decision. It's the 21st century and DNA technology is a proven science which should be embraced. Shame on the The Council of Islamic Ideology - just more anecdotal evidence that Muslim's don't provide equal rights to women.
Salma Khan
May 30, 2013 2:41 pm
Primary evidence means that the decision is made based mainly on the results of this evidence. Say, if a woman claims rape but four witnesses are not available, there is no prosecution. However, if the testing of the accused man's biological material shows the presence of his DNA at the crime scene (even if four witnesses are not available), based on forensic science, this should suffice to secure a conviction. The CII though seems unwilling to consider DNA evidence as the decider here. Apparently, they would rather wait for the woman to complete pregnancy, deliver and then do a paternity test. Doesn't make sense to me, does it to you?
May 30, 2013 2:42 pm
Humans are called 'Ashraf-ul-Maklooqaat' meaning 'there's a grey matter up there, USE IT!' Use it not for negativity, but for positive impact on mankind. When people insulted the Holy Prophet or Islam, he didn't order their heads off... he prayed that they become believers and he moved on to preach others! Patience, in the time of Adversity.... this is one (Very important) line in the Quran that these Islamic scholars conveniently forget and NEVER preach to others! Why? I loved the 'Islamiaat' 'Deeniaat' books that were taught to me in my childhood days. That taught me everything that a Muslim needs to know to be a good human AND a good ambassador of Islam. People converted to Islam in large numbers the Prophets (PBUH) time because he proved himself to be a model human. 'Haqooq-ul-Ibaad' (another important word deliberately ignored these days) are as important as 'Haqooq Allah'
E = MC2
May 30, 2013 2:46 pm
These tunnel vision mullahs are so intelligent that they thing it is ok, standing by a road side performing whatni with a stone is very logic but DNA testing sucks. These ex justice I don’t how many innocent people were punished because of their opinioned minds.
May 30, 2013 2:55 pm
What do these four 'pious muslims' do while the rape is happening?
May 30, 2013 2:57 pm
You forget only mullahs get elected in Pakistan. Dont you know one has to be 'pious muslim and ameen' (whatever that means) to contest elections?
May 30, 2013 2:58 pm
Is the printing of DNA strand Islamic?
May 30, 2013 3:43 pm
What are you on even a drop of saliva can nail a rapist in a DNA test. i do not know where you come from where it takes a man to tell some mad Qazi that a rape took place and he saw it,if so i would ask the question why these 4 men did not help the person being raped.ask yourself that question?
May 30, 2013 3:50 pm
All over the world DNA is prime proof in a rape case when a man says he has never seen the accuser or ever come across her she says he raped her even na drop of saliva as DNA will nail him. so how can that not be proof.
May 30, 2013 3:50 pm
well said.
May 30, 2013 4:33 pm
Where in the Quran does it say that there should be a clergy who should "advise" the people's representatives? I thought one of the unique things about Islam was that unlike, say Catholicism, there is supposed to be a direct dialogue between the believer and her God, and the believer isn't supposed to rely on the clergy to initiate that dialogue or to interpret the words of God. So, IMO, these mullahs are frauds.
May 30, 2013 4:39 pm
Our religion teaches us to learn. That is the first word in Quran. Not stop learning because of the religion. These guardians of religion has done so much damage to the name of Islam and Pakistan, we are better off without them. Let us not become a laughing stock of the world.
May 30, 2013 5:03 pm
Seems everything that is good for humanity is against Islam.
May 30, 2013 5:05 pm
A truly excellent post.
May 30, 2013 5:17 pm
I suggest that CII explain their decision in full on the use of DNA as supportive evidence and other issues on their own website so that people can easily understand the exact background of their decision. The coverage by dawn here is not only confusing but contributing to raise a lots of questions on the decision of CII. I am sure that people having detailed knowledge of justice system and ullema together have examined all aspects in this case before giving their deliberation.
May 30, 2013 5:23 pm
Can somebody please explain to me why is human cloning illegal?
May 30, 2013 5:24 pm
Can somebody also explain to me how is human cloning against islam?
May 30, 2013 5:33 pm
May be its time to resolve the issue and contribute in a more constructive manner rather than being harsh on religious leaders who are taught and prepared in the fashion as they are in their judgement about any issue, be it moon sighting or denying on DNA sampling as an evidence on rape. May God help these leaders who in the name of religion are tirelessly trying to propagate and mitigate Islamic teachings as if they were founders of this religion or its teachings. These leaders were given the chance in MMA and instead they pulled out their negative side to sabotage the entire society and whereas our religion Islam is most easiest and simply to comply with. But these sharia council and these GUYS persist and insist on for carrying out practices which are designed to meet their wishful thinking. Islam is based on purity, logic and the consequential results thereupon arising out of certain act (s) and so on. But whenever these leaders get a chance they always stir a new controversy showing us again and again that these leaders are nowhere and their thoughts. Until now these moulvies / moulana sahibs could not even fix uniform time for Azaans in respective areas and neither they will be able to declare eid on the same day in our country. Rather they are busy in meaningless quest for translations of certain words, time to ponder and rectify them and us as well who let these people lead us. Ailly
May 30, 2013 6:14 pm
A true example of yellow journalism and biased and ignorant sheeps to follow that. Another incomplete news presented with out enough background information to promote specific agenda. It is allowed as evidence but under circumstance. Dawn should have done responsible reporting and provided complete facts.
May 30, 2013 6:15 pm
Funny on how people jump on words on a news clip without knowing full details. DNA in rape can't be used as primary evidence because it can't differentiate between force and willingness. It just proves that contact happened. So of course there is a need for further evidence to first prove the claim of rape.
Syed Zain Hasan (@SyedZainHasan)
May 30, 2013 6:19 pm
If one really needs a testimony for that, wouldnt the witness stop the crime from happening in the very first place? Which person will have the audacity to witness a rape, and then come forward as a witness later???
May 30, 2013 6:20 pm
And the 4 men have to be impeccable reputation. So you would need for someone to rape before an audience of pious men. How realistic is that?
May 30, 2013 6:26 pm
Human cloning is not against Islam. There is a fatwa from Ulema in USA. Human cloning takes many shapes, this mullah probably thinks that they are trying to grow a human being. Human cloning includes growing of organs to replace damaged ones. Dr Siddiqui of Islamic Society of North America said in one of his sermons that any soul that Allah wants to be born will be born and we cannot prevent it. Everything happens by Allah's will. The body is just encasement, its the soul that is sent by Allah which counts.
May 30, 2013 6:29 pm
What if the victim is dead and there are no other witnesses? What if he/she committed suicide from the shame?
May 30, 2013 6:47 pm
Islam made a lot of progress when we understood the Quran .Iqra the first word .Shame on these Mullahs.
May 30, 2013 7:22 pm
We can ask Ulamas or Muftees if we have any question that the translation of Quran won't tell us but when it comes to DNA, let us not ask them. Ask the best people in this field.
May 30, 2013 7:29 pm
It is apparent that your knowledge of Islam is as good as your "forensic" science knowledge.
May 30, 2013 9:09 pm
if that is what is required then that is what is required there is no other way
El Cid
May 30, 2013 9:33 pm
Not so..! There is NO such law. She made an absurd statement. You have also used or fallen for her Straw Man Logic Fallacy or gambit. Otherwise cite a reference to authenticate your contention. What the Noble Qur'an categorically states is that if someone makes an ALLEGATION of a women being GUILTY of sexual immorality then THAT PERSON must bring 4 male witnesses otherwise the punishment will be put on the accuser for spoiling her name and reputation. Prove me wrong with a citation from the Noble Qur'an. Not from some 'he said/she said' nonsense Islamophobic website. Shariah Law is very strict against anyone making false frivolous allegations and accusations, specially ON women. And the false accuser is punished as if he did the crime.
El Cid
May 30, 2013 9:43 pm
Obviously you are way smarter, more mature, professionally accomplished, and educated than I can ever be. But this is NOT about me...have you not noticed?
May 30, 2013 9:43 pm
Our biggest guilt is that we recognize these people as Ulemas. They can't even decide whether moon sighting actually is correct or not whereas people from elsewhere have stepped on the moon itself!!! About time we retire these retrograde mullahs and judges to oblivion. CII is a waste of Pakistan's time, money and resources.
May 30, 2013 10:15 pm
Who is he?
May 31, 2013 1:17 am
Why do you want to consult ulemas and so called muftis??? Have not God Almighty given you commonsense of what is right and what is wrong in specific situation?? Do you want to be BLIND all your life?? Does not Quran Sharif talks about changing of time? Read it yourself, do not depend on ignorant people or else you will turn ignorant too! Politics has always been DIRTY, its a power struggle with all these people. They think God is watching everyone except THEM!!!
May 31, 2013 1:45 am
Unfortunate. These are so called 'ulema'.
Mustafa Razavi
May 31, 2013 1:47 am
Remember Pope John Paul pardoned Galileo only in 1992 for saying the earth revolves around the sun, Unlike our Mullahs, the Pope in 1616 did not just give an opinion, he had Galileo imprisoned for the rest of his life, according to less charitable accounts, Galileo was burned alive. In pardoning Galileo, Pope John Paul only said that Galileo's theory was correct, he did not acknowledge that the Catholic church had no business executing a man regardless of whether the earth revolves around the sun or the sun revolves around the earth.
Mustafa Razavi
May 31, 2013 1:48 am
Pope John Paul gave a fatwa saying human cloning is immoral, look it up on the net.
A. Khan
May 31, 2013 1:50 am
That to me, my friend, is an open licence to commit rape, as there will never be 4 pious men available to give evidence that they witnessed the actual penetration as a thread goes through the eye of a needle. So the victim can never really prove it, can she ? Isn't it sad that the burden is again on the victim rather than the perpetrator ? In other words, the victim is being raped twice, once physically and then psychologically.
Bakhtawer BIlal
May 31, 2013 2:17 am
IF you are so in support of that CII good for you. But you should know that rape is always forced. Is always despicable. Willingly done is NOT rape, weather we condone it or not.
May 31, 2013 2:33 am
What is the brilliant beyond brilliant reason this council thinks something as accurate and helpful as DNA sampling is against Islam? As far as I can tell Islam holds forth truth above all
May 31, 2013 2:35 am
Under what circumstances DNA match is allowed Mr. Asim? Can you be specific please?
May 31, 2013 2:39 am
The problem is that you are only allowed to "learn our religion" as it has been interpreted by a certain individual or individuals. There is no room for actual learning, it is all rot knowledge with no room for really engaging with the knowledge." Accept it as I am telling you"-is this really called learning? I don't think so.
May 31, 2013 2:50 am
Beautiful. Please enlightened us a bit further. In your esteemed opinion, how can a raped woman prove that it was a rape not an act of mutual consensus according to the huddod law? What is an acceptable primary evidence? Isn't it producing four adult, pious Muslim men who saw the act through their naked eye? Now, please tell me how is it ever possible? And in cases such as Mukhtaran Mai, when there were eye witnesses, what happened to them do you remember? Once there is a problem in the society, it will hit everyone at some point. So just wait until it hits home and then ponder on "difference between force and willingness".
May 31, 2013 2:56 am
We are followers of a prophet who was regularly questioned by people around him and he never discouraged anyone. Our early history is full of example of lay people challenging rulers and scholars. remember the story of the woman who challenged Hazrat Umar when he wanted a ban on women coming to the masajids? She said "how can you deny that when Mohamed allowed it" and his response was "the woman is right, Omar was wrong". So our scholars today have reached to new heights of divinity? they have become infallible? really-is that what our religion teaches? A human being is so perfect that he/she cannot be challenged or questioned?
May 31, 2013 2:57 am
while you are on it, please suggest some ways that a raped woman can get justice under the Pakistani brand of Islamic law.
sacha paki
May 31, 2013 3:10 am
lol saracsm
Sue Sturgess
May 31, 2013 3:37 am
which verses of the Qur'an refer to DNA
Sue Sturgess
May 31, 2013 3:44 am
yes, DNA cannot differentiate between willingness and force - other evidence is required for that
Sue Sturgess
May 31, 2013 3:46 am
actually this ruling was made to protect the reputation of Ayesha, after she was accidentally left behind in the desert, and spent a night with the man who rescued her
voice for true Islam
May 31, 2013 3:47 am
Yes, it is our duty to read and understand Quran, Please refer to Surah Al' Anam, when ALLAH commands believers (muslims), "Do not insult what other people worship. And insult not whom they worship besides ALLAH, lest they without knowledge wrongfully (out of spite) insult ALLAH".. Thus, muslims are not allowed to commit blasphemy against other faiths. The Blasphemy Law whether in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia is applied in the reverse direction, and should be removed. It is used for victimizing and committing injustice against people of other faiths.
May 31, 2013 3:49 am
they are talking about rape not adultery!
May 31, 2013 3:54 am
and authentic books and GOD fearing teachers
May 31, 2013 4:03 am
yet there is no verse in the quran on cloning but the quran does mention that human being is made from a clot of blood. Pretty sure the ulema did not have organs on mind but the reproduction topic!stop blaming everything on the mullahs or ulema
May 31, 2013 4:12 am
as long as it dies not break the rules of ALLAH as stipulated in the quran.Remember ALLAH swt says in the quran,that the quran is written in a language so easy for everyone to understand.Whether understood literally or in the light of hadith.
May 31, 2013 6:40 am
Whats the definition of rape as per CII. What are the Primary and which are the secondary evidence? Presence of DNA may not differentiate between consensual sex, adultery and rape, but why would any one cry wolf in first two case?
May 31, 2013 8:32 am
Is there any mention of DNA in Quran ? Or are these Mullahs...interpreting Quran the "mullah way" as they are stuck in time.
May 31, 2013 8:34 am
@Amir....ROFL ...that was a good one!!
May 31, 2013 8:35 am
And a revision in syallbus !!
May 31, 2013 8:40 am
You a scientist of .....???
raja hindustani
May 31, 2013 9:47 am
You are doing blasphemy by asking such question. ;)
May 31, 2013 10:00 am
Can you please, complete the news? BBC reports about a case where identified rapers were released due to this. If we could open our eyes!
May 31, 2013 10:01 am
mullah Unacceptable in Islaam.
May 31, 2013 10:03 am
Quran is made easy for every human being, no need of any jaahil mullah.
May 31, 2013 11:02 am
If four men witness crime and did not stop the crime, they should be prosecuted too. Does Islam has any provision to stop this crime and protect the victim?
May 31, 2013 11:06 am
why not. these ulema have done research and declared it illegal. they are ulema, dear. please learn to get guidance from ULEMA.
May 31, 2013 11:07 am
why not. these ulema have done research and declared it illegal. they are ulema, dear. please learn to get guidance from ULEMA.
May 31, 2013 11:09 am
dear your question is illogical. i think that it is a system to prevent rape.may be i am not able to understand you/
Left is Right
May 31, 2013 11:09 am
........bcuz its beyon their comprehension and mental capacity !!!
May 31, 2013 11:09 am
you are illogical. ULEMA ARE OUR GUIDES.
May 31, 2013 11:14 am
May 31, 2013 11:15 am
these ulema OR retired judges must have done research and declared it illegal. they are ulema, dear. please learn to get guidance from ULEMA.
May 31, 2013 11:34 am
Sir "Conjecture" is advised to be avoided more than once in Quran. Do you agree?
Muhammad Saad Hameed
May 31, 2013 11:35 am
I don't understand on what bases they have declared it secondary evidence, why they do not understood the fact that we are living in a modern world, and the most disappointing thing for me is retired judges are member of this council..
HIna Farooqui
May 31, 2013 11:49 am
Right, rape is not committed in front of audience. How can you have witness of rape????????? Why not DNA can be the proof of rape when you can prove that so and so child is so and so father???????????
HIna Farooqui
May 31, 2013 11:51 am
Do not expect justice from judges
Jamil Dehlavi
May 31, 2013 11:51 am
The reporting from another source may help. It basically underlines the fact that Mullas are becoming more and more irrelevant and with their medieval interpretation, they are making Islam irrelevant as well for the 21st century
May 31, 2013 11:57 am
a female DNA donor would be the clone's genetic twin, rather than mother, complicating the genetic and social relationships between mother and child as well as the relationships between other family members and the clone
May 31, 2013 12:06 pm
They make sure it is a rape and witness everything so they can give a good account of what has happened. As they are brave men of God, they go the court next day after exchanging notes on what had happened. What a perfect picture of Muslim men.....
May 31, 2013 1:03 pm
I agree with the spirit of what you are saying, but even here the Mullah gets his way. Iqra means 'to read', and not necessarily to understand. So we read the Holy Quran, but never try to understand it.
May 31, 2013 1:08 pm
Bull's eye!
May 31, 2013 1:11 pm
Religions are meant to serve the powerful. They always favor the rich versus the poor, and men versus the women.
May 31, 2013 1:14 pm
Excellent post. Unfortunately, we are already the laughing stock of the world. It is a painful reality.
May 31, 2013 1:21 pm
Hi, It will be interesting to know what are deemed as primary evidence? While DNA test can confirm that sexual intercourse has taken place, it does not, on its on, prove that this was a consensual or a forced act. Going by that logic, DNA can not be the primery evidence for rape convictions. There needs to be other forensic evidence to support this like signs of struggle, weapons used etc to complete the evidence. I am not sure why DAWN has not mentioned CII's proposed primary evidence. It may well be the traditional testimony of 4 pious men but it should be stated in the report as this is a sensitive matter.
May 31, 2013 1:32 pm
Your opinion only shows your ignorance about the whole issue.
Muhammad Ashraf
May 31, 2013 1:37 pm
Why dont you go to Mullah and ask him why it is against Islam. I would recommend Dar-ul Uloom for this purpose
May 31, 2013 1:47 pm
I do not understand how DNA test makes a primary evidence for an alleged rape and not of adultery: how can you differentiate? Only by having witnesses, and remember that if there are no four witness, neither adultery nor rape is proved, Secondary evidence of DNA coupled with circumstances can prove something in favor of a woman, but it is not sufficient for giving capital or 100 lashes punishment to a rapist. That is what Islamic position is mostly in the view of Fiqh Malkia and Hanfia. Moreover, people who do not practice Islam need not comment on Islamic issues. And those who want to practice should decide before speaking if they want to follow Islam or Islam to follow them. These commentators mostly appear nothing but the ignorant.
May 31, 2013 2:40 pm
Please seek/request comments of a Mufti.It is not an easy subject for general people to explain to you.
May 31, 2013 2:40 pm
DNA test is used to identify the criminal, not to prove whether forced or wilingness. Use your brain
Imran A.
May 31, 2013 2:54 pm
Wow... so you approve of the fact that if someone in your family was raped, and since there were no 4 witnesses except for the DNA sample. That person should be forgiven??? May Allah have mercy on us.
Imran A.
May 31, 2013 2:57 pm
It is against humanity because creating another human being with emotions & feelings is just wrong. How would you feel if you were a clone but because the science was not perfect, your life expectancy will be 15 years. Islam is about humanity first.
May 31, 2013 3:07 pm
Cloning should not be done, not from religious perspective but as a humans, we should keep it natural. And as for DNA, don't ask Mullahs.
Imran A.
May 31, 2013 3:08 pm
When it is rape, the man is stoned. When it is not rape, both can be stoned due to mutual consent.
Imran A.
May 31, 2013 3:10 pm
She was talking about you
May 31, 2013 3:16 pm
I think you are not able to understand a lot of things. It's actually a system to prevent prosecution of rape. Bet you didnt get that either.
May 31, 2013 3:17 pm
All Pakistani women should have four very pious men on speed dial.
May 31, 2013 3:31 pm
This unfortunate country has been hostage to the Mullahs and Media.
May 31, 2013 3:36 pm
You are most welcome to give them offense. They need it.
May 31, 2013 3:54 pm
Is driving a car or travelling on aeroplane Islamic? Are wrist watch, television, cell phone, digital camera, electric fan or electricity itself Islamic? Are charging a cell phone wirelessly, Wi-Fi router and internet Islamic? Which of the http, https, ftp, ssh protocols is Islamic? Are Java and C# Islamic? Or only Fortran, BASIC or Ada are Islamic? Are Newton’s laws of motion or gravity, theory of relativity, laws of thermodynamics and Kaplers laws Islamic? Are Fusion and Fission reaction Islamic? what about Centrifuge technology? Are particle, quantum and nuclear physics, aromatics, optics, mathematics, genetic engineering Islamic? Are vaccinating, lifesaving drugs or medical science Islamic or only the medicines without science are Islamic? Are space technology, drones, robotics, graphene, hydro carbons Islamic? Though art, literature history of ancient cultures, entertainment, and sports are un-Islamic, perhaps many would believe. Shame on CII
May 31, 2013 4:24 pm
For a science-illiterate technology-ignorant MIND -- everything that is incomprehensible is anti - Islam.
May 31, 2013 4:37 pm
What we need to understand is that we should stop taking Mullahs seriously.
May 31, 2013 4:44 pm
having the time of their llife
May 31, 2013 4:45 pm
having a time of their life
May 31, 2013 4:48 pm
..... and fewer Madarsas ..... and fewer Madarsas..... and fewer Madarsas..... and fewer Madarsas
May 31, 2013 4:53 pm
A minimal IQ level would also be welcome ......
May 31, 2013 6:08 pm
Take their turns ofcourse and then deny that it all happened!
El Cid
May 31, 2013 7:36 pm
@Allaisa: They are Fabricating Straw Men and Building Glass Houses on Foundations of Sand. Your question in based on untruth and propaganda memes being propagated on the web. It has NO foundation in fact.
El Cid
May 31, 2013 7:43 pm
Since you are a lot smarter than I can ever be...why don't you please demonstrate your "Knowledge of Islam" and minimum functional IQ by citing a primary reference.
May 31, 2013 7:54 pm
Until masses are educated and influence of Mullahs contained the future of this country looks bleak.
May 31, 2013 9:31 pm
Maybe DNA is mentioned in the Quran. Why else would they say no to it?
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